[SPOILERS] Nakor and Jester..Second time's a charm :)

[CFCJesterFool]

Sian and Gavagai have met. You can see it in the F... screen.
Sian has already teched Writing. We can offer Open Borders to him.
Let's get graphs on Sian first and then go back to Gavagai with EP's.

I think we should whip the Axe in Moria and put the OF into either a worker or a Library. We're working two unimproved tiles there!
Or we can wait untill it grows to size 4 (3 unimproved tiles! ) and then whip a Settler.

Do we gain anything by offering open borders? Until we have Sailing we won't get any trade routes (assuming he has a city on the coast). We can offer open borders if you want although I don't think it is necessary right now. Sure, we can get graphs on Sian then switch back to Gavagai.

We'll have the gold improved in 4t (same turn Moria grows to sz 4). As limited by commerce as we are now, working a FP is not a big deal. We could whip but that just delays working the gold full time (so is a net loss on commerce). The axe (which isn't even needed right now and would also cost upkeep) can be whipped at sz 4 (for better OF) into a library and we would then work the wheat+gold+FP cottage since we'll have the FP cottaged the same turn we finish improving the gold. In short, in 4t we will be working 2 FP cottages and the gold.

[CFCJesterFool]

We found Slowcheetah...


The diplo screen...


Went ahead and offered Sian open borders. I was ambivalent until I saw that Gavagai didn't have open borders with Sian. Maybe we have a common enemy? It seems we are the first to four cities, at least amongst the players we have met.


Redemption...


Moria...


I was mistaken...better to whip the axe. I think I got Moria mixed up with Waterdeep. Also, it takes 6t to cottage a FP so got that wrong too.
Waterdeep...


Whipped the axe here to deal with the barb warrior. Notice how the granary never had time to fill? For some reason I was thinking that was the case at Moria (reason I thought the whip would delay working the gold). Another axe would be useful then probably a barracks since this is our best unit pump. A library here would be wasteful.
Wall St. ...


I think we want a library here first. A granary will need some production (or forest chops) to get built in a reasonable time frame while a library can be 1 pop whipped easily due to the Creative trait. In this case, I think a 1 pop whip of the library into a granary makes the most sense.
The demos...


The gold and cottages can't come online fast enough. At least we are expanding decently. Our pop count looks terrible but we haven't started going vertical yet.

@ Nakor : Have you thought about whether we should grab the horses or Mids site next? I am not so sure anymore. We have spawn busters in place at both sites (plus we'll have axes available anyway). Your call. Also, do we open borders with Slowcheetah?

[Nakor]

Good to have another contact! Let's offer OB.

I think Granary before Library in Wall St. If we whip, we can whip more effectively with a Granary. To speed up the build, we can give the cows to Wall St. There are 4 forests to chop, enough for both the Granary and the Library.

Redemption will regrow on a Library (or Barracks? Good unit pump!) and whip another settler size 5/6?
Moria can be a unit pump as well. We need a farm north of the wheat at least. Good to see you agreed and whipped Moria.
Waterdeep could be more commerce, I think, so I'd put a Library there. The Axe can kill the barb warrior next turn. Getting a few cottages there will help. We can chop a Settler there as well.
Wall St as mentioned above will be our commerce monster with hopefully an Academy.

I think Riker should start roading towards both the Mids and the horses site.
I think we should get 2 settlers out soon and settle them both. Don't really see what we need to settle first. I think Mids - Horses is ok. And then we can start on the Pyramids with Stone connected. Therefore the road by Riker.

Took a long look at the west of Redemption and I really don't know how to settle there. We need to get the Whales in a city.
Did you notice the Crabs near the Island in the east? Good settling option there as well once we have time to build a Galley in Redemption.

A lot to do and so little time...
We really need more cottages to get our economy in order for city 5 and 6.

Once those cities are settled, we can settle either the Island, or more towards Gavagai. We can fill back later.
I'd love to have a scout near the Marble to see what Slow does.

Tech path: Masonry - Fishing - Sailing - Maths? Or do we go for Monarchy?

[CFCJesterFool]

Good to have another contact! Let's offer OB.

Ok.

I think Granary before Library in Wall St. If we whip, we can whip more effectively with a Granary. To speed up the build, we can give the cows to Wall St. There are 4 forests to chop, enough for both the Granary and the Library.

We don't want to whip actually. Can't borrow the cows (since Waterdeep has no food until CS). The granary will just take too long without forest chops (and commerce is more of a priority). We'd be at happy cap long before the granary was complete (so what is the point). At least with the library, we could 1 pop whip at sz 3 (the workers should be able to keep up with the cottages until that size) to keep from working unimproved tiles (plus also get another library). We really need the library more than the granary. Regrowth from sz 2 to 3 without a granary is 6t (long enough to lay down another cottage). Having said that, we don't want to whip. I'd rather get down two cottages to work and then use 1 chop (40H) to finish the library then slow build the granary. The granary is really only necessary once we have a higher happy cap.

Redemption will regrow on a Library (or Barracks? Good unit pump!) and whip another settler size 5/6?

Library then settler at sz 5 (2 pop whip). Then grow on barracks followed by 2 pop whip at sz 5 of another settler.

Moria can be a unit pump as well. We need a farm north of the wheat at least. Good to see you agreed and whipped Moria.

Yes, gold then the farm.

Waterdeep could be more commerce, I think, so I'd put a Library there. The Axe can kill the barb warrior next turn. Getting a few cottages there will help. We can chop a Settler there as well.

We won't have spare worker turns for some time so until Waterdeep has cottages, a library is wasted. Much better to pump military. The library can get built once we can get cottages down. Chopping out a settler or two is a good idea but that will have to wait for a worker to become available.

Wall St as mentioned above will be our commerce monster with hopefully an Academy.

I think Riker should start roading towards both the Mids and the horses site.
I think we should get 2 settlers out soon and settle them both. Don't really see what we need to settle first. I think Mids - Horses is ok. And then we can start on the Pyramids with Stone connected. Therefore the road by Riker.

Sounds like a plan. I actually was planning on finishing the farm (1t) and then send Riker and the new worker to both start roading. Redemption will do fine with 2 mines/farm/corn/cow to get out the next two settlers. The axe from Moria will escort.

Took a long look at the west of Redemption and I really don't know how to settle there. We need to get the Whales in a city.
Did you notice the Crabs near the Island in the east? Good settling option there as well once we have time to build a Galley in Redemption.

A lot to do and so little time...
We really need more cottages to get our economy in order for city 5 and 6.

Once those cities are settled, we can settle either the Island, or more towards Gavagai. We can fill back later.
I'd love to have a scout near the Marble to see what Slow does.

Tech path: Masonry - Fishing - Sailing - Maths? Or do we go for Monarchy?

Masonry for sure. Then it depends. Do we still want to take Gavagai out? We probably should do Fishing and Sailing since some of the sites we want require those techs. I still think bulbing Math and heading to Construction is feasible. Chops for the Mids (so we get it) and then Monarchy could be delayed since we'd run Rep anyway.

[CFCJesterFool]

Offered open borders to Slowcheetah...


More exploring courtesy of Gandhi...


The demos...


The GNP makes me sad. Our first cottage finishes next turn and the gold has two turns left. I left Wall St. building the library. We get double hammers on the library and I don't think we want to whip there at all. I don't see where we get the worker turns to chop out a granary. If we get to a point where we do have a free worker available, a chop into the library (for 40H pre-Math) does us more good.

[Nakor]

GNP will get better. We need to claim all the land we can and then tech ourselves back up.
Bulbing will help with that, but then we need to work specialists...
We're gettting there in the end...

[CFCJesterFool]

@ Nakor : I marked the map with my thoughts on how to grab the whales. I don't think I've ever settled for whales. The main problem is that the spot you marked would have zero early natural production, except for whipping ofc. I'd rather have 2 mines and not waste the forest. We would have cultural control over the whales in 50 turns (without any culture buildings) so could get the happy boost anyway once we finally reach Optics.

[Nakor]

We're pretty low on happy...
I think your suggestion works better then mine!

But then, how to fill up the rest of that land...

[CFCJesterFool]

We're pretty low on happy...
I think your suggestion works better then mine!

But then, how to fill up the rest of that land...

The other site you marked was fine (has some food and production). Pretty lackluster land so not much that can be done with it, although once we reach CS (and can spread irrigation), it won't be so bad. I like your idea about grabbing the island (clam) and cities toward Gavagai before we worry about settling the land out West. IMO, so far our city placement has been much better this game.

[CFCJesterFool]

More exploring...


Cultural borders we can see...


I checked EP again and Gavagai has definitely met someone we haven't (plus has put enough EP on them to get their graphs). I could be wrong, and he has met several other players that we haven't, but then again, how freaking big can this continent be? Slowcheetah declined our open borders proposal and Gavagai didn't even bother offering them. I think next turn I need to send a warrior to the marble area to keep an eye out for boats. The demos...


First cottage done and starting on the next one. We finally start working the gold next turn. I swear I know how long it takes to cottage a FP (5 turns). The starts on Deity are usually pretty terrible so it has been a long time since I've cottaged FPs in a game.