Civac and the Last Pitboss

[BaII]

I know the game has already started but the micro plan should still work even if you've dumped a few turns into hunting already

[civac2]

Can you post the exact micro? Settler timings by themselves are not sufficient on their own in my estimation.

I have changed my mind a bit and now favour skipping AH (and mining the sheep instead). I get the settler on turn 33 and BW on turn 34 which unfortunately does not line up perfectly. Your approach may well be superior. Though I don't understand why you want to delay Hunting. AH will be in time either way. You do get Fishing faster with your ordering but that only saves 1t.

Barbs are off I think.

[BaII]

You might want to check the barbs then. When I loaded the WB save from the one posted in the thread I was getting barbed animals spawning. Although that might be an issue on my end with how I opened up the WB file because I do recall a request for barbs to be turned off.

T12: Worker completes starts farming wheat -- City works FP and starts WB
T13: AH finishes Start fishing
T14:
T15:
T16: Wheat improved City swaps to wheat
T17: Worker goes to sheep
T18: worker starts pasturing sheep -- City grows to size 2 works FP
T19:
T20: Fishing completes -- start Hunting
T21: Pasture completes -- City swaps over to pasture
T22: Worker Road sheep tile -- City grows to size 3 picks up FP
T23: WB completes -- City works clams
T24: Worker walks to deer tile puts 1t road down waiting for hunting to finish
T25: Worker starts improving deer -- City has the option of 1 finishing the warrior by working a 1f/2h tile or directly starting settler. Micro will be based off finishing warrior variation
T26: Warrior completes start settler City works FP while waiting for deer tile completion
T27:
T28: Worker finishes deer improvement -- City picks up deer tile
T29: Worker finishes road on deer
T30: Worker starts roading towards the city
T31: Mining finishes start BW
T32:
T33: Worker finishes road on City 1 tile -- Settler moves there and settles turn of -- Cap has 8 hammers of overflow right now can finish warrior in 2 turns even while giving away deer tile and working FP -- BW will finish in 9~ turns.

The big decision on T33 is if we want grow to size 5 or start a worker right away with all that overflow. Haven't tested out those 2 options that much. There is technically a 3rd option of just pumping out a 3rd settler but seems inferior just by a glance. Will show a sample below for reference. This is assuming cap gives away deer and works FP and starts warrior

T34: Worker starts farming corn
T35: Cap warrior completes and grows to size 5 works a 3 foodhammer tile doesn't matter which since we're starting a worker
T36:
T37:
T38:
T39: Worker finishes farm and goes directly onto ivory -- Cap finishes worker that one also goes directly onto ivory. Starts a settler due in 7 turns (if we do this we time ivory improvement with City 1 size 3 growth)

Let me know what you think. We still have time to swap off hunting and go with this route because there is a little bit of give between AH completing and needing it for improvement and there is a bit of give with the timing of completing the fishing tech as well.

Few other things is there any naming scheme you wanted to go with? And we can also move this microing onto a spreadsheet if you want to do more of it... Though I'm not too interested in keeping it up to date past like turn t50~

[civac2]

So like this.

[BaII]

Yeah that is correct

[civac2]

As mentioned, Hunting before AH is better. If you keep everything else the same we get the picture on the left side.



Pretty much the same as your approach except, we are up 4 hammers, 16 beakers and a worker turn with only the road on the sheep missing. (That road is useful but not worth a worker turn at this stage imo.) It is also possible to finagle the worked tile selection to get the settler a turn earlier at the cost of some commerce. This is the picture on the right side.

Regardless, I still think skipping Animal Husbandry and mining the hill is the best option. It's a pretty orthodox play and I am bit embarrassed I didn't think about it sooner. I will talk about it in the next post.

[civac2]

Mining the sheep hill produces the settler at a comparable time. This is mostly due to a mine on sheep hill being identical to the pasture in food hammers as long as we make settlers or workers. Sorry for yet more spreadsheets. But I wanted to show them for you if you want to compare or try some things yourself.



I am likely going for two hard-built settlers in a row once the capital reaches size 4 and all tiles have been improved. A second worker would also make sense. However, it's not strictly needed and I want to preserve as many of the sparse forests around the capital for wonders (Apo, Sankore). Not sure about this. Perhaps getting another worker and chopping into the second settler is better. What do you think?

Left version includes a bunch of machinations to begin settler building with 8 overflow so that two settlers in a row can be finished in 6 turns each. Downside is that we lose a lot of hammers to weird tile allocation and can only squeeze out one warrior beforehand. Right version gets two warriors but would need 7 turns for the second settler. Currently, favouring the less clever version with two warriors for increased safety. (There are Tarkeel's Zulus in the game after all.)

With getting BW directly at the expense of AH we are able to whip and chop sooner and are less vulnerable if bordering the Zulu. What ultimately convinced me is that after BW the next tech I want to research is not AH but Pottery. It makes little sense to research AH before BW if the priority is so low.

[civac2]

On another note, our scout has reached the next appendage to the right. No contact yet. The plan is to double back afterwards to meet the leftwards neighbour as well. I want to get graphs on both quickly and check if the Zulu is among them.

[BaII]

Oh you're good on the spreadsheets I just find them a chore to make and maintain but if you're maintaining them no complaints from me

We can check from the WB file who our neighbors are correct? I mean the file was just given to us... I don't think Zulu was one of our neighbors when I was simming with the WB file although let me know if that's not proper etiquette.

That's a fair point on the Pottery, I was thinking about even delaying BW until after Pottery since there are so many good tiles for us to cottage but we would be lacking a lot of hammers if we do go this route so not recommended.

No one has Copper or Horses in their capital right? I haven't checked the WB file but we can check for our neighbors specifically since the map is known and we can work backwards. So if someone settles their strategic resource around turn ~30 they probably can get to us at the earliest of maybe turn 55 in the case of a dedicated rush? I'm not as familiar with rush timings though so please correct me if I'm being  . The main vulnerability I see for us is that we get access to our copper on T50 unless we want to settle a suboptimal city and 2 warriors don't seem to be that helpful except to cover for unlucky dice rolls in the event of a rush.

That said I think having an extra warrior is really handy for MP and it's only saving 1t on the 2nd settler so I'm still favoring the 2 warrior variation. Let me do some testing on the worker vs settler. The main benefit I see from it is speeding up the development of the 3rd city by chopping out a WB. I'm heading on a 5 hr flight today so I'll have some time cook up something.

[civac2]

Yeah. You are right. The WB file should tell use who our neighbours are.

Main use of warriors in a defensive sense would be as mobile spotters near the entrance to our peninsula. For MP purposes we could make some warriors later. Copper will be quite late as you said. All the capital areas look very similar to ours. No one can get horses or copper without settling for it.

In the single worker, two settler case the settlers come out far enough apart that the worker can first improve the corn and then chop a work boat for the other city.

Current planned continuation (in spoiler so as not to bias you if you want to try out options yourself):

Capital whips a worker 4->2 overflow + 1 chop finishes granary.
Corn city whips a worker 2->1

This is not optimised quite as I would like. City #4 would be somewhat late for example and there can be issues with working all resource tiles at all times.