[Spoiler PB62] Vanrober in a new chapter learning from Miguelito

[Miguelito]

we can whip the settler for 2 pop this turn, is there a reason why you didn't?

and without giving it proper thought I feel the FP cottage would be nice

because if we do we get not the max of possible and the wheat wont be done when the settler arrive, so i felt like it wasnt as good as waiting one more turn

Not the max of what?

We are building that settler with 9 food surplus which gets converted to hammers at a bad rate instead of letting the city grow. We should aim to do that for as short a time as possible.

Also an earlier founding gives us an earlier culture expansion and 2f1h which at some point might be useful, although it seems that for the early growth it doesn't help.

I also copy my edit to the previous post, as it seems to have crossed your reply:

edit: we may want to give the tundra FP to Helium this turn and work a forest at Hydrogen instead. The overall foodhammer output is less that way, but Helium gets its foodbox fuller, and Hydrogen just loses some afterthought overflow hammers.

[vanrober]

we can whip the settler for 2 pop this turn, is there a reason why you didn't?

and without giving it proper thought I feel the FP cottage would be nice

because if we do we get not the max of possible and the wheat wont be done when the settler arrive, so i felt like it wasnt as good as waiting one more turn

Not the max of what?

We are building that settler with 9 food surplus which gets converted to hammers at a bad rate instead of letting the city grow. We should aim to do that for as short a time as possible.

Also an earlier founding gives us an earlier culture expansion and 2f1h which at some point might be useful, although it seems that for the early growth it doesn't help.

I also copy my edit to the previous post, as it seems to have crossed your reply:

edit: we may want to give the tundra FP to Helium this turn and work a forest at Hydrogen instead. The overall foodhammer output is less that way, but Helium gets its foodbox fuller, and Hydrogen just loses some afterthought overflow hammers.

Not the max Overflow i meant.

About the tundra thing, i dont understand.

[Miguelito]

The basic tenet (and I got that from Rusten, for credit) is that you generally want to avoid using the food-to-hammer conversion while building a settler/worker, even if you're not Imp. Instead you want to use the food to grow your cities and whip them.

That conversion is 1:1, which is worse than the 1:1.2 that you get from a 2pop whip 4->2, and much worse once granaries come into play. Usually I try to max hammers in cities which ar ebusy with workers and settlers, giving away the food to other cities meanwhile, to the point of running a food deficit occasionally.
That is not possible here atm, as we have only food and no hammer tiles (not complaining), and also of course with 2 cities you can't shuffle around as much.

Of course, as always there are valid exceptions to the rule, maybe in this case you really want quick hammers from OF for the axe or whatever.

But that is why I'm suspicious about converting food into OF hammers at the 1:1 rate, and also why I think it may be better to give Helium 1 more food to grow this turn in exchange for 2 less hammers at Hydrogen. Of course the latter is a minor concern.


Btw that plains FP is super yummy

[vanrober]

Okey ill whip it this turn and move the floodplains to Helium.

And yeah your suspicion was greater than expected!!!!!!!!

[vanrober]

I trust your criteria, but i dont see why losing those 2 of OF is better than growing the city, losing a improved tile as is the farm of the FP makes me crazy, and i really cant understand, yet at least. But i did what you said.

       

About the new city proposal, i like it, its more packed than the ciudad? sign, but the city? 2 east of that city plus the ciudad one, seems better to me? There is not good tiles in the tundra, but a couple of floodplains. So losing that deer seemed hard to me.

   

[Miguelito]

As I said, it's minor, and I'm not totally sure it's good even. I also really don't want to push you towards anything, just throw out ideas that I get while looking at the map, because that's where the fun in dedlurking is for me. But only do stuff that you feel comfortable with, please.

My idea with qué tal éste was to set up the city as a commerce hub, getting both super FP tiles and a bunch of quality cottages, plus the silver. 1W (tundra forest) is even nicer, but gives up the PH city square and is a whole lot worse on defense, if this ends up as the naufragar border city (not unlikely I guess).

We should start to think how we want to specialize the cities, and on this terrain there is a peril of ending up with only a bunch of low pop foodhammer cities.

[vanrober]

I just want to understand and learn from your thoughts. Really, the title its pretty clear, you are already telling me things that i didnt know or i didnt pay atention on. I dont feel pressed nor pushed to do anything, so dont feel bad about it.

What i meant were, why do you think its better to get 1 food more in Helium and not working one improved tile while working an unimproved tile in the capitol and losing 2 OF? I really dont understand, but i want to understand. Im sure there has to be a reasoning im not getting, maybe because of the language gap, idk. But i want to understand so that i can do it in next games.

[vanrober]

Fabled finished archery i believe, his production is crazy so maybe he is being atacked by a neighbour?

           

Im not sure what to do in Helium, i wanted to make a worker and granary there but since its growing in 2 turns i think it makes no sense to make the worker now, i would wait to lvl 3 to get it a bit faster and maybe 1 whip it? Or it would be better to go to size 4 to 2 whip it into the granary axe and spear?

Mjmd 2 whiped his city too, so he is getting third city fast too. Lets see where

[vanrober]

turn 39
Mjmd settled on this turn. i think we couldnt have beat him settling in the gold anyway. we are settling next turn in this case or the gold case. So im glad we didnt lose at least the movement to get there.

He has 2 warriors around, and just in case i moved our into the forest to see the city and also to be safer. Moved the axe towards him just to be sure we are fine defending the spot. HE was the one taking archery, his power rised in 6K while Bing was 5K, i thought maybe it got hided by the whip the rest of the increase but nah it was just that.

             

And an archer of barbars appeared in the south, im wondering if whiping out the axe to try to defend our land or not, maybe next turn once we are 3 pop? maybe we dont care? not sure.

[Miguelito]

Are we building a spear somewhere, at least 5 hammers into one to be able to whip? I know we really want granaries, but a bit of preparation against chariots is necessary.

And can we move a warrior to the deer to have a chance defending against the archer? Otherwise I'd likely whip the axe and build a road on the grassland (if the worker still can). Don't want to lose that deer.
That's a nasty archer, and how do the barbs have archery already?

The border with Mjmd should be fine, as far as that's possible given the map layout.