[No Players] Where the Lurkers Take Their Holidays

[Tarkeel]

I'm not sure 7 needs as much as a dozen, there's some floodplains there that don't show on the minimap. But yes, those two changes and then balance resources and it should be set.

Looks like a very interesting shape; probably more pangea-like than the strip of land they're expecting, but I think they will enjoy this one.

[Tarkeel]

I had not expected Napoleon (CHA/ORG) to be the first leader picked, but there you go. Very interesting picking phase so far.

[pindicator]

I keep tinkering but I think the big stuff should be about right now:

https://1drv.ms/u/s!AoD3LrzhKrtJhdt3aWO_...A?e=J0ar9l

Give your thoughts

[RefSteel]

For those who can comment more usefully with a picture than with a WBSave, apologies for the tiny resource icons at which you might have to squint to distinguish them (there's some incense in the desert, some silk in some of the forests, and I think only one sugar on the whole map) but here's an attempt at a graphic representation, with the start positions as clear stars in [EDIT: magenta circles, to hopefully make them easier to spot]:

I'd need to look at the map longer to make a reasonable guess about balance (even to the extent of knowing if anybody's area is ridiculously out of line or not) but I like the looks of it. (Not pictured: The Easter Egg for those with carriers, satellites, or submarines.)

[RefSteel]

Glancing around, one quick item: Access to early strategics looks quite uneven. Some have their nearest horses 6 tiles away, while two have horses (and another has a copper!) in their starting BFCs.

[pindicator]

I was thinking that the larger distances between players would allow for more flexibility there. If lurkers don't think that is the case then I can adjust.

[Tarkeel]

I might not get time to look at it before tomorrow.

[Qgqqqqq]

Flexibility is fine, but I agree that early strategic shouldn't be in the BFC.

[Tarkeel]

Copper should never ever be in the BFC, and not in a spot where if you do a likely capital move it's in the BFC. Horses can be under certain circumstances: We had capital horse in PB62, and that worked but only because we didn't have any animal foods that would lead us into an early AH research. Even then it's safer to move it elsewhere.

As for iron, one could argue that everyone having it on a capital hill for safe mid-game metals makes some sense, but then it needs to be equal. (Looking at you PB66 with your horribly exposed metals)

[RefSteel]

Strategic check, without consideration for other factors:

0/"Persia": BFC Horses, though less severe as this area might delay AH for a long time. No Ivory access though, and while Wellies can be built with iron, IW is an extra tech that others don't need when they want to build them. Also, no access to Stone, which is more important than Marble, especially since it boosts Walls and Castles.

1/"China": Should be fine for strategics. (Including Ivory and Stone.)

2/"Zulu": BFC river Horses in a capital with an AH resource can start a Chariot with one pasture and no roads and has two neighbors each 15 tiles away (the minimum on this map). I advise moving the horses. (Maybe six tiles south from their current location?) Has both Ivory and Stone.

3/"Babylon": Questionable access to Coal and land Oil. Maybe move the nearest Coal five tiles south (to the hill just north of the Aluminium) and put an oil on the bare desert to the start's northeast (just south of the Silver)? Also unlikely to get any Ivory, and its closest Stone is closer to (though contested with) 7/"Japan". A bit worried about this player getting cut off from the center too.

4/"Inca": Questionalble access to Coal; no access to uranium in case the game goes that long. Maybe just put a coal in the BFC (on the bare hill, maybe "moving" it from the hill way off to the start's west) and add a Uranium just anywhere nearby. No access to Ivory, and its nearest stone is contested with 9/"Egypt" with no food (just an oasis) on the 4/"Inca" side. Also a little worried about getting cut off from the center.

5/"Rome": BFC Horses in a capital with an AH resource; I'd at least move them east by 2-3 tiles. Questionable Coal and land Oil. Maybe move an Oil to the lone patch of flat desert surrounded by desert hills, wheat, and ivory? (From the open desert a little further south/westish; this is still far, but less contested.) And move the nearest walkable coal (near the central desert, two south of a plains cow) three tiles northwest to a different hill (two south of a river rice)? It contests two Stone (one with 7/"Japan," one with 8/"Vikings") but both are foodless (the one between it and 7/"Japan" has an oasis nearby; neither has any other tile that can exceed 2f before Biology.

6/"Greece": No access to Stone.

7/"Japan": No access to Uranium. May as well add one nearby in case the game gets that far. Contests two Stone (one with 3/"Babylon," and a no-food-but-an-oasis one in the desert with 5/"Rome")

8/"Vikings": Lacks Uranium, which may as well be added just in case. Also lacks Ivory, and the nearest Stone is both utterly foodless and contested with 5/"Rome."

9/"Egypt": The only start with Copper in the BFC; definitely move it away - maybe just three tiles south, just past the Cow? No uncontested access to land Oil; maybe just move the closest Oil three tiles closer (to the three-tile desert south of the Horse). No real access to Uranium either, so may as well add some just in case. Also lacks Ivory, but clearly controls a Stone (and contests another with 4/"Inca").