very brief chat w/ scooter, with more to come when he gets home from work
scooter: yes I'll be around again later
oh no problem
me: what time will yo be back on?
you
scooter: probably in an hour and a half or so
me: k
scooter: real quick though just in case - so you need support into nth?
i've got 5-6 mins now
me: well, im gonna need help yeah
scooter: which F is going into Nth?
me: first, i've got news from mattimeo. TT told him he was gonna hold the line and let you take cores if he didn't give him a deal. BUT matt doesnt really have anything to give him, he's not giving up a core.. so
HEL
scooter: that's nice. TT kind of gave me a similar-ish threat, but it's much easier for him to defend vs T than vs me
ok. so you supporting with Den too?
me: I think yer gonn have an easy-ish time
yes
scooter: and Nwy? or is nwy doing something else?
yeah I think so. very good chance I can take venice
me: im not sure yet, ill be certain when yer back on
scooter: ok
I mean you could support with nwy and guarantee nth, but it also means Edi won't fall
well and also subject to rowain cutting support
good chance of that
me: yeah
or he bounces me in finland, not suree which he'll do
we have a chat, he's gonna put up a bigger fight than TT, that's for sure
scooter: yeah probably. though T is a real threat to him so he's in a bad spot
me: on that note.. curious when you're planning to evacuate BEL?
well T isn't stabbing him this year, I don't think, we'll see about the future
scooter: I can do that once we have E's centers under control
that'll be the best time probably
me: they aren't as close as we are anyway
so, does that mean fall, if we can guarantee lon and edi going into fall, or next year?
scooter: yeah we can do it this fall if the spring moves go our way
guaranteed no later than next year
but I think this fall is prett ylikely
anyways, gotta run. I'll be on as soon as I can.
me: ok, catch you then
Sent at 4:55 PM on Monday
scooter is offline. Messages you send will be delivered when scooter comes online.
Please don't go. The drones need you. They look up to you.
well, we had a nice long chat with scooter before the deadline.
In retrospect, there was only one point where minor alarm bells went off - when he was asking exactly what we were going to do with A BER. In prior conversations, he hadnt been that interested in our other units <shrug>. Maybe the fact that he didn't want us to move into TYR to help him take VEN should have also piqued our suspicion.
This stab was very unexpected. I disagree with his assertion that "an FG joint victory" is nearly impossible. I think we were in as strong a position as we could hope for.
Argh! - I feel like I failed - My job was to look out for stabs - and *wow* that was a stab. I did not conceive that he could end up with TYR, BUR, and RUH all in one season. But there they are - baby blue.
Damage control:
1) strategic
We have to jettison MUN
We can take some risks with other units hoping to get lucky - i.e. the fleet in HEL is misplaced. maybe we can get it into HOL and move HOL->KIE.
We can expect to lose NTH unless we do NWG->NTH, and support from DEN and HEL.
If we do that, we will lose SWE, so its SWE or NTH.
The turtle plan would be moving BOH->SIL and BER->KIE, DEN->SWE (support from NWY), HEL->DEN. That allows NWG to do whatever- i was thinking maybe CLY would be an interesting move - assuming scooter will issue NAO->NWG, we could slip into LVP in spring. Unfortunately, molach could do EDI->CLY and LON->WAL in spring and take LVP back in fall.
ALternatively, moving NWY->SWE with DEN support and NWG->NWY with the other turtle plan moves covers all centers (except MUN, of course).
2) diplomatic
we have no viable friends in the world
obviously France has better offer for Italy than we do.
Austria is done
Russia has no reason to work with us after we ejected them from NWY.
Turkey is our best shot, but what can they do for us? nothing What can we offer them except resistance against France, which we would be doing anyway? nothing
If we thought the potential for a stab was there, i guess we could have done HOL->BEL just to bounce something
well its gg for us unless you work some magic with the telegraph.
--
Best dating advice on RB: When you can't hide your unit, go in fast and hard. -- Sullla
chat with rowain (there might be some hope here, but apparently, you and I hacked him off ):
Quote:8:02 AM
me: Rowain! can you remove this splinter from my back?
oh... its not a splinter, its a dagger? how'd that get in there?
Rowain: Ouh what splinter
8:03 AM
I think you have to ask Bigger how that dagger got there
I'm sure you have my essay about good pay in your logs (and for sure enjoyed hearing it )
8:04 AM
me: heh indeed
my fault too- i was supposed to be looking out for things like that
but -- units in RUH, TYR, BUR was unforseen
8:05 AM
Rowain: really? How did scooter sell the Army in MAR to you and how did he explain Molach disbanding the Army?
8:06 AM
me: well, we both expressed concern about moving on Italy as soon as practical
so that seemed in line with that
8:07 AM
based on his earlier communications, we expected Molach to disband the army
didn't attribute it to scooter's action
8:10 AM
Rowain: I'm still surprised that you 2 thought that taking Norway made sense.
8:11 AM
me: i think we fell into the trap of thinking we needed a core each year
8:12 AM
otherwise we would fall behind scooter and he'd be able to push us around . but you know - the extra core didn't do much , did it?
8:13 AM
Rowain: But you would have gotten VIE and kept a friendly russia
me: TT told us Tatan was moving into VIE and Tatan was unresponsive during that time
8:14 AM
Rowain: In fact you wanted to attack Russia to badly . taking NWY supporting the none-existend Tatan-move into VIE and building into BER
8:16 AM
me: well the support into VIE was just for a lack of anything else to do - you told us you were moving out of VIE - so we didnt think it would have any affect
and it turns out - it didn;t
Rowain: And when I told you Give back NWY don't build in BER or we 2 are at war which means scooter will attack you - you (well Bigger) laughed.
me: actually its funny - if Tatan would have moved into VIE
8:17 AM
we probably would have built in MUN
to support him
but his moves again showed he was out of it - not coordinating with TT or us
8:18 AM
so we abandoned that plan and BER seemed like the place to build - the thought of a non-build didn't occur to me because we were taking NWY - why take NWY and pretend to be friends with a nonbuild in BER was my thought
8:19 AM
Rowain: Because the game is called Diplomacy
8:20 AM
There isnothing wrng with stabbing or attacking mind you but before you do it make sure your other side is covered and save
me: heh
looked safe, sounded safe, wasn't safe
8:21 AM
Rowain: I was not angry because you attacked me but because of the bad play it involved
All you could hope to really get out of it (and thats in the best case szenario) was STP
8:22 AM
If scooter had not stabbed you I'm sure turkey would have attacked me sooner or later and gotten the most of it
8:23 AM
me: that's scooters explanation as well
he had to stab ebcause if we keep going the way it was going, turkey would get the big share and it would be a 3-way problem
8:24 AM
so - how do we move forward and prevent the map becoming an ugly mix of blue and yellow?
8:25 AM
Rowain: Yeah that is the problem right now
I do want centers too but I don't want too much lightblue
8:28 AM
OTOH Germany has been, despite my best effords, quite unfriendly so getting it Smaller instead of Bigger would be nice
me: understood!
7 minutes
8:36 AM
Rowain: In truth I still don't know what to do now. How to proceed without getting a too big france.
6 minutes
8:42 AM
me: yeah - its a tough situation. please think on it a bit - I'll have a chat with bigger and we can meet back up with you soon.
8:43 AM
Rowain: It will most likely have to wait till tomorrow as Ozzy & friends give a concert tonight
8:44 AM
and you should show up in the Ww game
me: yeah - i;m catching up now!
--
Best dating advice on RB: When you can't hide your unit, go in fast and hard. -- Sullla
bigger: so, waterbat has been reminding me, the only sure way to guarantee EDI falls is if you can support me in the fall from CLY
yeah
scooter: yeah i'll need to order lvp/cly I think
bigger: so I wanted to ask you that
me: then your fleet in ENG gets a head start
bigger: ok
7:31 PM
me: on its way to MAO/etc
bigger: well, that still risks a NTH bounce, if rowain cuts my support from NWY
scooter: cool gif but it moves a bit fast so its taking me a few mins to parse it
me: heh sorry only 2000 ms delay
7:32 PM
scooter: though this has me supporting myself into lon
me: bigger is right - it does risk the bounce if rowain cuts support
scooter: yeah the nwy cut seems risky
me: we could move NTH and SWE->NWY
7:33 PM
move NWY->NTH
bigger: if you're willing, I would prefer the cly support and nth support, then you could take LON in fall, I take edi in fall, seems safest
me: that works too
7:34 PM
scooter: fleet in clyde is just so awkward though
that's what I'm not crazy about
bigger: yeah
scooter: that's WAY out of the way
bigger: well next year, you mvoe cly to nao, ENG to mao, and you con convoy to africa in the fall
scooter: that's 2 full years away from italian centers
bigger: maybe directly to TUN
7:35 PM
depending on what TT disbands this year, either TUN or ROM will be easy pickins next year, no?
7:36 PM
scooter: well, next year I'll be fighting T far more than I
i'm realizing italy is pretty irrelevant hah
me: yeah, but we dont leave Italy much options either
scooter: yeah
bigger: next year? not sure t can break through in 1904
me: so TT would be easily swayed by any T or R offer
7:37 PM
bigger: he still has to finish off austria, and i'll do my best to delay that
me: he was already working with R early game
scooter: T is going after italy next though
he's got nothing else to dow ith his 3 fleets
he built A Smy too. that's to convoy
that's going to be my real battle
me: hmm -- that's true - i guess it looks the same from that direction "
7:38 PM
bigger: imhoping to talk him into moving that army into position to hit russia from the south <G>
scooter: now that would be better
bigger: i think he might in the fall, after he's got russia's help getting tri
scooter: yeah he might.
7:39 PM
bigger: anyway he might not even take ion this season, if tatan supports tt in ion
me: i wouldnt put it past Rowain to negotiate getting TRI
its 5-7 over there
7:40 PM
in cores
scooter: yeah
that whole area is weird
bigger: yeah, I don't think rowain really has any negotiating power of turkey at the moment
me: haha
bigger: anyway, rowain will likely get vie.. last I heard they hadnt worked out who got which first
scooter: anyways, on north sea -
i really prefer a situation where lvp is going to either nao or iri
7:41 PM
me: he thinks he has negotiating power with us, why wouldnt he think he has it with Turkey, his actual ally
scooter: lvp-cly is a bit too awkward and out of the way for my preference
bigger: true
me: ok - youd rather that than a quick ENG->MAO ?
7:42 PM
then support us into NTH and we can also move NOR->NWG, right?
scooter: well eng has to stay put as is
right. I'd rather help with the Eng fleet if that makes sense
and the army
bigger: he means eng-mao in fall, after you've taken lon in spring
me: yep
7:43 PM
scooter: oh i think I see what you're saying
me: i no LVP->CLY, then support us, so we can get NWG and take EDI ourselves in fall
bah - i = if
7:44 PM
and NWG = NTH + NWG
scooter: yeah. I do prefer that. it's mostly to have an emergency outlet in case italy slips through in the south or something crazy
i'm ordering wes-lyo. if he orders tys-wes for some insane reason, i'd like to have myself covered
bigger: well
are you worried about italy making it to MAR?
scooter: i doubt it, but he was threatening similar things to me about letting mattimeo in
no, i'm going to order wes-lyo so mar is safe
but if he orderes tys-wes, he's touching spain and mao
bigger: ah
scooter: spain is critical because center, mao is critical because of everything
7:45 PM
bigger: well, look
scooter: so if I have fleets in eng, nao, and lyo for instance
i'm safe in the fall for sure
i can force myslef into mao in that case and cover spain
bigger: spa is safe, if he slips in wes you can move lyo spa to safely bounce him
7:46 PM
scooter: right. it's just a defensive thing though - if he cuts some vassal deal with T and orders tys-wes and then wes-mao i'm screwed
bigger: i think supporting ion is his most likely move tho. I like the lyo move, you don't want to cut his support
me: yes be on the alert for it
scooter: I slightly regret not building F Mar instead of A Mar. I think that was short-sighted.
oh I agree
but that's my reason why I prefer not having lvp-cly
7:47 PM
if lvp goes to nao/iri, i'm 100% safe and it doesn't really slow down the england invasion
7:48 PM
me: i thought he was going to do tys->tun
but we havent talked to him afaik
bigger: well my concern is its possible molach moves edi - NWG, which is smart really as it bounces me and and prevents me taking edi by myself this year... moving to NWG also prevents me from making a move on STP, so BEL could be the only core I pick up
me: i guess he could do ion->tun tys->wes and let turkey in as you said
7:49 PM
scooter: I have no idea what TT is doing haha. I think he's making it up as he goes. can't blame him though given the position he's in.
me: i thought he made great move last turn - but without coordination with Tatan it fell flat again
7:50 PM
scooter: yeah I think he's played well in a really bad spot. happens a lot with italy - somoetimes you just have no options
me: sorry - back to Biggers comment about EDI->NWG being a pain in our ass again
7:51 PM
scooter: i don't think it's super likely
bigger: maybe not, more likely than tys-wes tho :P
scooter: right but it's my fleet haha so I weigh things differently. anyways, since i'm supporting you into nth with Eng
7:52 PM
why not I just order wal-yor
me: was just going to say that
scooter: would make it easy
me: but it doesn't matter because in fall you are taking LON with it, no?
scooter: i don't NEED london this exact turn
it can wait a year. besides, once I take it i'm just giving you belgium
so technically it's "yours"
7:53 PM
I can guarantee you get edi
that way
me: lol
scooter: so if I'm in york, if he gets lucky and orders edi-nwg
I let you into edi and he OCC's for a year
me: watch molach doh LON->YOR too
scooter: and we do the london/bel thing next year
if he doesn't order that (not likely)
me: that most improbable combo
scooter: then both fall in the fall
7:54 PM
that way I don't have my fleet out of position, you get Edi no matter what
everyone's happy? haha
7:55 PM
me: he could hold EDI with LON->YOR and EDI->NWG this year - but i agree that is pretty unlikely
bigger: I like that.. what do you think of me forgoing nth-nwy to put pressure on STP, and maybe take it (but not edi).. i'd still need the lon for bel trade tho, and could take edi myself next year
7:56 PM
scooter: nth-nwy?
bigger: no, something like swe-FIN, the fin STP supported from NWY in fall
7:57 PM
me: nwy->nwg i think you mean, right?
bigger: oh yes
thank you bat
scooter: oh right. nah I want to get this england thing done with so I can move down south. T is going to be a monster and I have just 1 fleet down there atm.
bigger: ok well
7:58 PM
you'll support me into nth from eng this turn, and move wal - york, supporting me into edi if its needed
and I take belgium whichever turn you take england (hopefully this year, but next year if necessary)?
I can live with that
scooter: supporting hel-nth correct?
jsut to make 100% sure
bigger: england = london i mean
yes
scooter: ok good
7:59 PM
sounds great
me: our spring 1905 moves look strong vs. russia - your spring 1905 moves look strong vs Italy
scooter: guessing you're getting into sil or pru huh?
me: we're on a good path
scooter: really hoping i can take ven in the fall. decent chances - only austria can screw it up for me
bigger: they'll look a lot better for me if I can get 2 builds, heh. Russia is getting VIE most likely this year, wish I could take STP to deny him a build oh well
8:00 PM
me: well, we are trying to get Austria to go into VIE with our support
but who knows with him
bigger: im not even sure austria will submit moves this season.. he already has two strikes and im pretty sure he's checked out even moreso than molach
8:01 PM
me: 6 RT armies looks scary as we just have the 2 in theater at this time
scooter: yeah
trying to bounce russia somewhere with berlin or push?
bigger: water wanted me to move pru, I thin SIL is safer tho
8:02 PM
scooter: pru would be pretty sweet
bigger: probably just supporting tri to vie again with BOH, hoping tatan does something
scooter: would scare russia a bit hah. it is a bit risky though so i get that
is he going to order tri-vie?
8:03 PM
me: but who knows with him
= Tatan
scooter: yeha
me: he sent us a message saying the Archduke was assassinated
bigger: i dont know, my only other option is GAL to cut support
me: try again later
that doesnt work if TRI isnt even going to VIE
scooter: well i'm guessing rowain may actually order something like gal-vie with bud support?
8:04 PM
or maybe not
with you in the picture it may be bud-vie with gal support
me: or if GAL is moving in and RUM is moving up into GAL (possible, but will make his backside a juicy Mattimeo stab target)
bigger: I guess if I took GAL i might have a chance w/ WAR in fall, if I get really luicky
scooter: worried about war-pru at all?
8:05 PM
me: oh that's true if he doesnt move RUM up
bigger: yes
although MOS OR LVN TO SUPPort stp is possible too
me: hmm WAR -> PRU is interesting as a spring move
scooter: yeah
8:06 PM
me: especially if we are in SIL
and we intimated to Rowain that we could take PRU
bigger: i could always move back to ber to bounce, or take war
me: so he might just do that order for a bounce
scooter: espec since he knows denmark is right there
den-bal and ber-pru is fairly scary for him
8:07 PM
me: would we rather build A BER though - if he lets us back into BER we cant build there- i guess A MUN isnt that bad
8:08 PM
scooter: it's not bad if you go north with boh since then you're not tripping over yourself
but yeah BER is prob slightly preferable for you
8:11 PM
bigger: so anyway since mvoes are due in 45 mins.. I move HEL-NTH, supported by me from DEN and by you in ENG. I move NWY-.. (and swe-NWY to keep rowain out of norway) you move wal-york, lvp iri, pie-tus, mar-pie.. right?
scooter: yep
got it
bigger: cool
scooter: sent
bigger: well we could take edi, lon and ven this year.. that would be nice
8:12 PM
scooter: that would be pretty amazing.
me: indeed
8:13 PM
you know - if we eliminate england
we should be able to read his thread - like secret papers discovered
8:14 PM
scooter: we probably can't technically... but I think it'd be fun in the future if the rule was you COULD
me: <shrug> with Tasunke at the help - probably isnt much in there
bigger: well the problem is he might reveal information about russia or turkey or italy in it
me: the spoils of war
help = helm*
8:15 PM
scooter: yeah that's why it's probably not allowed, but it would be nice
bigger: doesnt really fit with diplomacy, or with the spoiler thread rb theme
im gonna run to the store for cigs, come back and submit moves (I know mardoc loves the last minute submissions, hehe)
me: i can submit them if you want bigger
8:16 PM
bigger: well im still thinking about the ber and boh unit, to be hoenst
me: k
me too
--
Best dating advice on RB: When you can't hide your unit, go in fast and hard. -- Sullla
quick chat with scooter - I remained civil - i guess trying to salvage some spirit of cooperation even if we are screwed.
Interesting he said Molach didnt give him the "do it for the ratings speech".
Quote:12:51 PM
me: so you finally gave into Molach's "do it for the ratings!!" rants?
12:53 PM
scooter: actaully he never suggested such a thing to me. I guess you guys were the privileged ones
12:54 PM
me: haha
12:55 PM
indeed it was a privilege - they were great
12:56 PM
sure , our dismantling of england was ho-hum, but i was expecting it to get interesting as we tried to gobble up the 2 headed juggernaut
12:57 PM
also there arent really any lurkers - maybe 3 if you count mardoc
scooter: i think a stab will come from that arena in not too long
12:58 PM
and I'm not really interested ine xciting for the lurkers, but exciting for me is a convincing argument
12:59 PM
me: agreed
7 minutes
1:06 PM
scooter: did you have any idea it might have been coming?
10 minutes
1:16 PM
me: sorry stepped away
1:17 PM
uhh... not after spending an hour with you just before the deadline
i mean - it was my job to look for those things - so i failed Bigger in that regard
scooter: I felt I had to or else you'd sniff it out. I'm so paranoid about that stuff.
1:18 PM
i had not purposely been so quiet in the 36 h ours before then
so I needed some kind of contact
as I really was busy befor ethen
me: i just didnt imagine you'd end up with units in all those imprortant squares
scooter: yeah it was a very narrow window
1:19 PM
me: just kind of accepted the fact that you were going to tus and pie
1:20 PM
'twas a great play
1:21 PM
but - i fear if you keep the gas pedal depressed, we will be of little use to anyone.. but a doormat for Rowain to wipe his feet on
scooter: well, you do have quite a lot of territory now
that won't go away quickly
so your position isn't lost at all IMO. just difficult
me: i mentioned it was 6 vs 2
scooter: the clincher was the russia stab probably
1:22 PM
me: oh yes
that was certainly the clinchers
scooter: i think that's been your only indisputable mistake. otherwise I think you guys have played great.
me: as - we are isolated now and your timing is aligned with that
scooter: yeah
1:23 PM
well I wasn't a fan of that move, even though I didn't try to talk you otu of it
me: heh
scooter: and russia defintiely wasn't
me: of course
scooter: but yes, I suppose ratings will go up
23 minutes
1:47 PM
me: yes from a 5 views a day to 6
1:49 PM
scooter: 16% increase!!! :D
hah
er no, 20
--
Best dating advice on RB: When you can't hide your unit, go in fast and hard. -- Sullla
Matt: Ouch, that has to hurt...
Sent at 2:16 AM on Tuesday
me: yeah
heh
did you know about it? :P
Matt: no idea
would have said something if I did
scooter was the main threat even before this
me: kinda looks like the whole board except for tatan was plotting against me.. although Im sure thats just paranoia
Matt: not going to be making it easier for him
me: ah cool
Matt: I wasn't against you, just not explicitly with you against Rowain right at that point :P
me: I know
Matt: but yes, I'm a little too far away for that to be all that relevant
me: anyway, he might not have even been coordinating w/ rowain and TT, not sure at this point, I needed a break before I started diplomacy again
heh
Matt: heh
me: so leaving SEV is curious, are you planning to give it back to Rowain, or just emptying ship for a convoy?
Matt: Rowain was probably just being Rowain :P
me: yeah.. I expect harsh tones and "I told you so"s when I talk to him
haha
Matt: Current deal is we probably want to use the units elsewhere, so Sev and Rum to remain empty
but yeah, given the Mos move I'm thinking I should have left it there :P
then again, I'm usually too paranoid for my own good
me: well, the mos move doesnt hurt me
PRU move woulda been much more scary to me
oh
Matt: yeah
Lvn would have been just as good for hitting north as Mos
me: i guess MOS coulda support defended STP, except he moved to FInland, meaning I woulda bounced and made that irrelevant
Matt: and covers Prussia as well
me: yeah
Matt: I'm hoping he's doing it to be agressive up north :P
me: so, I dunno.. I guess you can see for yourself, dont need to try and manipulate you :P im not sure whats he's doing yet anyway, tbh
Matt: everything he's actually told me as fact he's stuck too so far, though
willing to grant him the benefit of the doubt 'til he actually breaks that
(and not just "I wanted to break that, but people are idiots and didn't tell me") :P
me: fair enough
pls tell me asap when you change your mind so we can try and coordinate, im going to be in hedgehog mode this season anyway, trying to get help where I can
Sent at 2:57 AM on Tuesday
Matt: well, Rowain has historically been attempting to ally with you, apparently :P
maybe after he does his "I told you so" speech, he'll agree to go hit me instead :P
me: hah
I wish I could get him to hit scooter
Matt: in related news, that is actually a semi-serious worry of mine
yes
me: but not sure that's possible
Matt: I wish I could get everyone to hit scooter
me: well, work a deal with TT and he might
Matt: trying to work a deal with TT at the moment
me: and you could always talk to molach and convince him to work w/ me as an equal instead of scooters vassal
(although a year or two and I might be in a position to be molachs vassal, heh)
Matt: every convo I've had with TT so far has pretty much degenerated into us yelling at each other though :/
so I'm not too confident there
me: oh, damn
Matt: good point with Molach, though
me: wtf, is it getting personal?
Matt: nah
well, I don't think so
me: thats kind of like my last 2 convos with Rowain.. plus we have the ww13 hangover (him basically calling me an idiot over and over in the lurker lounge after he died)
Matt: just, we got off on the wrong foot 'cause of his fairly obvious Lepanto signalling
he didn't seem that appreciative of my slightly over-reactive defence against that
and since then, any conversation I've had with him hasn't represented what's occured on the actual board in the slightest
me: ah ic
Matt: apart from the last one, where he basically threatened to let scooter take his centres while he continued holding ION
I might have over-reacted slightly about the type of person who would throw a game like that :/
but yeah, I can imagine talk between you and Rowain would be awkward from the WW game
in related news, I'm a villager again
me: lol
Matt: being wolf is so much more fun
me: keep it in the thread, that feels a bit like cheating
(im playing in that game too)
Matt: unfortunately, I'm rather obvious about having mroe fun in RL games, so I keep getting killed
yes, I know :P
propaganda about yourself being village is obvoiusly meant to be spread everywhere you get an opportunity, right?
:P
(I'll shut up about werewolf now)
me: on a related note, im gonna start writing ww15 now, mardoc volunteered to co-GM and help me make sure its balanced.. so just letting you know you hafta play ww15.. Ill need 18-21 players, i think
it'll be fun for you village or wolf
its not a big deal, you could still be lying, just a grey area i'd rather not risk
Matt: cool, I'm down for as much werewolf as possible
and of coruse if I was a wolf I'd be telling you I was a villager :P
me: yeah I enjoy it vm too
Sent at 3:08 AM on Tuesday
me: anyway, im gonna get back to writing it. I could possibly hold this season if I make every correct guess and everything goes perfect... so if you happen to talk to scooter and can get a read of which units are moving on MUN, HOL, or kie it would be very useful :>
Matt: definitely
I'd be assuming he'll try to garuntee taking Mun, but that's just how I'd be going about it
also slightly wishful thinking, since I have a vested interest in Tyr going north :P
(mainly 'cause it's not south)
me: well even if he did that he probabl would support from tyr
Matt: still it's using Tyr in a way that doesn't impact Vie or Tri
me: anyway im just assuming you want me alive to hinder scooter and rowain
true
certainly he'll use it on MUN and not vie or tri
Matt: yes, I definitely want you alive at this point
Sent at 3:16 AM on Tuesday
Matt: mainly to hinder scooter, hopefully we can get Rowain to join in on that as well as he can
mitigating the need for you to be hindering each other
me: yeah
Sent at 3:18 AM on Tuesday
Matt: k, I'm heading off now
me: k
Matt: will grab you if I learn anything about scooter's intentions
me: thanks!!
Sent at 3:20 AM on Tuesday
Please don't go. The drones need you. They look up to you.
great job bringing matt in. did you see my chats with Rowain and scooter from earlier -tried to soften the ground for you to work your way back in on both of them.
Glad you got to talk to Molach too - looking forward to seeing the chat
--
Best dating advice on RB: When you can't hide your unit, go in fast and hard. -- Sullla
ok im caught up, Ill catch you up now. I suppose you got the rather unobservant email from tatan "well apparently I got into VIE. can you support hold me?" yeah, I don't think Ill be able too. Not sure tatan saw the scooter stab when he wrote that. anyway, I also talked to Rowain and Molach.
Rowain was after matt
Rowain: Hi Still up
Sent at 5:20 AM on Tuesday
Rowain: ?
me: yeah
for a little bit
I suppose I owe you a chance to say "I told you so"
Rowain: Wouldn't help much would it?
Sent at 5:22 AM on Tuesday
Rowain: OTOH you were lucky that we bounced in SIL and therefor in GAL
Sent at 5:23 AM on Tuesday
me: yes
I seem to have pushed you back, but left myself open to a more serious threat
obviously I misjudged my position with scooter. both his intentions, and more importantly, his ability to stab me. really showed my greenness
Sent at 5:26 AM on Tuesday
me: anyway, im not real sure where to go from here, haven't done diplomacy yet, needed a destressing period
Rowain: Yes such a surprise needs some time to rebalance oneself
me: lol
yes
Sent at 5:29 AM on Tuesday
me: anyway, are you looking for revenge and to race for scooter for germany cores, or something else?
German
Rowain: I have not decided yet how to procede
me: ah
Rowain: I wouldlike a center or two (for example those in scandinavia)
me: did you coordinate with scooter, or was it a happy coincidence
yeah, I figured that
Rowain: but a complete and total turning of Germany into french territory is not that much of my liking.
me: well thats comforting
Rowain: Not coordinate but I told him that you were gunning for me and he hinted that he might use the opportunity
me: yeah
technically I didn't gun for you, you notice I didn't go for STP
me and waterbat did speculate you would leave STP open, as you did, but I went for edi instead
Rowain: Mooving into SIL and GAL
me: but it doesnt matter now,
well yeah that was mostly defense, I didn't expect to take GAL or for you to leave war exposed
and grateful for the bounce now, would be bad if I had taken gal heh
Rowain: But I had to leave WAr else STP might have become undefendable this fall
me: right
anyway I guess once scooter was solidly at war w/ italy I would have tried to invade you, no use denying that
but the game is changed for me now, anyway hehe
Sent at 5:35 AM on Tuesday
Rowain: Of course we might have gone to war but as said tacking NWY was too early
me: well, in hindsight I guess you're right
:P
Sent at 5:38 AM on Tuesday
me: anyway, im sleeping soon, let me know what you'd like and what we can do to repair relations. Im obviously going to be in a dogfight w/ scooter and would prefer not to have surprises from the east. and, obviously, im in a humbler position now
Sent at 5:41 AM on Tuesday
Rowain: I have to think about how to proceed too. today s evening I'm seeing Ozzy & friends so it might take soemtime tomorrow till I'm good at Diplomacy
me: ok cool, let me know
Sent at 5:43 AM on Tuesday
Rowain: the dilemma: A destoyed germany which is completly french is not good OTOH a few more Russian centers would be very nice too
Sent at 5:44 AM on Tuesday
Rowain: Will think about it Till tomorrow
me: ok
tty then
Sent at 5:46 AM on Tuesday
much less I told you so to me than he was to you. probably because I was expecting it . no committments but same thing he said to you - he doesnt want me weak. He did not know scooter would stab, but he had encouraged him to do so..
probably will have to at least give him norway at some point, maybe sweden too. not sure yet if this year or next.
convo with molach:
me: well, congrats. looks like you got the vassal role you couldnt get from me. England isn't dying anytime soon, apparently
Jamas: Yeap
We could have ruled the world
me: honestly, I was interested. I just couldnt see an opportunity to stab scooter, he defended himself too well. I thought I had too, of course, lol.
Jamas: In the words of Lord Baelish - I warned you to trust noone. He made the approach, though. I was content dying (and reading the lurker threads)
I'm only talking to scooter, you know if the rest of the world is resisting him?
Havnen't enough experience to see where it is going. Suspect he will need my centres in the end
me: yes, if he wants a solo victory
Sent at 5:42 AM on Tuesday
me: well, russia and turkey won't benefit scooter eating me up quickly. I don't think ill be dogpiled, although neither can actively help me. TT is the question, but I don't know the answer to that yet
anyway, are you allowed to pick up a third core, or stay where you're at?
Jamas: No promises made yet. Just - live and serve
me: ah
Jamas: I'll try to get 3rd, harder to invade me then
Or takes more effort
Naval
Sent at 5:45 AM on Tuesday
me: well, keep your eyes open.. im in a different situation now, obviously, if the opportunity arises for you to stab scooter and ally with me, we'll be allied as equals, not vassals. hell if you're able to grow I might have to vassal to you at some point :P
just putting that out there, if you feel the itch at any point, let me know
Jamas: Fair enough.
Fun game, diplomacy is
me: heh
im too green, only played one game before and that was a decade ago, I shoulda seen this coming
Jamas: Never got 7 friends together, so unfortunately didn't play it the real way.
me: yeah
Jamas: Okay, ned to exp some tanks in WT
me: ttyl
Sent at 5:49 AM on Tuesday
Jamas is offline and can't receive messages right now.
backs up your convo w/ scooter - molach shut down once we refused him, but Scooter came calling to him. so he's not promised any cores or really even long-term survival. Of course I can't really ask for him to switch sides right now, scooter would eat him up. But I did promise him if that opportunity ever came we could ally as equals, not as with him as a vassal. he seemed open minded, thats promising.
OH! and I talked to TT, most encouraging.
me: hey
Sent at 5:49 AM on Tuesday
me: got a sec?
Twinkletoes89: not long but go on
me: oh
I was just curious if you knew scooter was going to stab me.. if you had worked a deal with him or just saw it happen
Twinkletoes89: Not a clue, if I had I would have moved Alb to Tri rather than retreat it
I was expecting a move into TUN and TUS or Ven
me: yeah, seems like scooter shoulda give you a heads u at last minute so you could slow down turkey
yeah me too <G>
Sent at 6:23 PM on Tuesday
me: hmm, ok. well if the opportunity comes up for you to move into TYR, pls take it. I guess I'll send you and email later with some thoughts if you have to jet soon
Twinkletoes89: yeah an email may be better - may not have too much free time before the deadline as its degree results day tomorrow for my other half
me: oh cool
good luck TT's wife!
Twinkletoes89: thanks - hopefully she shan't need it
anyhoo, I'd best be off. Shall look forward to reading your email when I can
me: k ttyl
Sent at 6:27 PM on Tuesday
so he also knew nothing about the stab - seems like only molach and that rat Gaspar knew . he may be a useful friend.
Please don't go. The drones need you. They look up to you.
I don't want to give up Munich, I'd much rather give ground to Russia/England in scandanavia. Munich is probably the most important province on the board - all stalemate lines run along it, and I think scooter (or turkey or russia, too) will need it for a solo victory. plus it has a lot of reach.
The question is, can we hold it? If not, of course we need to ditch it and preserve other cores.
scooter has 3 units that can reach munich, 2 that can reach belgium, 1 that can reach kie. KIE capture is easily prevented by moving the DEN fleet down (which is terrible position, but I dont seem to have a choice. anyway, 2 scenarios -
1. we ditch munich. i can move the berlin army to kie, keeping some fleet control in the north. I can try to get into nth, but with molach's 2 ships and scooters fleet in eng they can bounce us (still, we bounce them out so its not all bad). I can move BOH mun, and ask TT to cut support from tyr unit, meaning either HOL is safe or scooter doesnt take MUN. or I can hope scooter uses all 3 units to get into MUN and use the BOH unit to prop up Tatan (probably not).
2. defend everything: possibly I can defend MUN by myself. one of the BOH or BER units supports the other into MUN. then the HOL army attacks RUH, cutting support. if the actual attack comes from tyr or BUR, this will work. (BUR seems much more likely). However, this fails if the attack comes from RUH - and I think Scooter is sharp enough to realize that. If he really wants MUN he will attack from RUH, i think. the solution? Ask TT to cut support from the TYR unit. I do think it would be in his best interest to see me strong, I may be the only ally he has right now (other than a dying tatan), and I will offer him a favor to be redeemed later in return (anything short of giving up one of my cores). if he follows through MUN is 100% safe.
so I think I like number 2 better. but there are some problems, namely Hollland and NTH. NTH I will probably have to give up, which may bite me in the future. IF i give up the NTH, I can support hold with the HEL fleet and hold it as well - even if the RUH unit attacks MUN, as long as the attack fails the HOL army will stay in HOL to receive support from HEL. the danger of course is that if TT doesn't follow through, the HOL unit could capture RUH, leaving an empty HOL and allowing scooter to take it unsupported from BEL. that would be a disaster, but I think we have to take the chance. Thoughts?
Please don't go. The drones need you. They look up to you.
oh well