TheArchduke and the Gentleman Bastards lead the Mongol Horde

[TheArchduke]

Wow, the AI is inept at the game.

And the developers REALLY do not know how to play their own game. As if there was any doubt looking at the streams.

My testgames in SP so far.

Scotland breaking the sound barrier on scientist and science.

   

Mongolia in full Magnus Steward abuse mode.

   

Chopping is the main mechanic to advance your game to a higher level. Chop overflows into walls or galleys (100%) are awesome and Agoge chops (50%) are good.

So what do you add? A frigging +100% chop steward.

   

With Ancestor Hall things go even more insane, but audience chamber is better. And with 150% those stone harvests churn out settler 1 a turn.
I just ended a turn 60 Lautaro game because I had 5 cities and 2 settlers whilst the AI has mostly 3 cities.

There is some odd stuff as well, as moving CS bonuses and trade routes behind buildings. Pop has been downgraded for science as well.

Which means adjacency for districts became a bit more important. Chopping critical infrastructure like markets is invaluable.

[suboptimal]

What also makes things a bit ridiculous is that the base ability of a governor takes effect as soon as the governor is placed in the city. Magnus can just hop and skip all over the place, +100% here, +100% there. This makes getting districts (and Tier 1 buildings) out a crapton easier as you can almost 1-chop them with good overflow, among other things. One question to be figured out is whether it's better to get several governors with the first wave of promotions or to get one and promote repeatedly.

I think what will cause a larger "strategic upset" is the loyalty system and how far players will be spaced out on this map. For example, if loyalty were a thing in PBEM 6 Mouse Spider probably would have flipped back over to me before you took Irukandji. Likewise with your conquest of Maruf. I don't know if razing cities close to an opponent's core will become a thing but it seems that unless one can grab multiple cities in an invasion it may be difficult to keep conquests. People over on CivFanatics have been saying that they have lost a conquered city in 3-4 turns, even with a governor moved over or nearby.

[TheArchduke]

What also makes things a bit ridiculous is that the base ability of a governor takes effect as soon as the governor is placed in the city.  Magnus can just hop and skip all over the place, +100% here, +100% there.  This makes getting districts (and Tier 1 buildings) out a crapton easier as you can almost 1-chop them with good overflow, among other things.  One question to be figured out is whether it's better to get several governors with the first wave of promotions or to get one and promote repeatedly.

I think what will cause a larger "strategic upset" is the loyalty system and how far players will be spaced out on this map.  For example, if loyalty were a thing in PBEM 6 Mouse Spider probably would have flipped back over to me before you took Irukandji.  Likewise with your conquest of Maruf.  I don't know if razing cities close to an opponent's core will become a thing but it seems that unless one can grab multiple cities in an invasion it may be difficult to keep conquests.   People over on CivFanatics have been saying that they have lost a conquered city in 3-4 turns, even with a governor moved over or nearby.

I think that although the Ancenstral Hall on paper looks good, Magnus can handle the churning out of settlers.

And you want the audience hall and governour spam for housing. Housing is always the restricting factor and 0.7 or 0.5 science, pop is where this game is won.

By the way, suboptimal, as my dedlurker what do you want to see me play as?

[Woden]

What also makes things a bit ridiculous is that the base ability of a governor takes effect as soon as the governor is placed in the city.  Magnus can just hop and skip all over the place, +100% here, +100% there.  This makes getting districts (and Tier 1 buildings) out a crapton easier as you can almost 1-chop them with good overflow, among other things.  One question to be figured out is whether it's better to get several governors with the first wave of promotions or to get one and promote repeatedly.

I am pretty sure it is just the loyalty that takes effect immediately. The abilities are available once the governor is established.

[suboptimal]

By the way, suboptimal, as my dedlurker what do you want to see me play as?

I don't really have a preference between Mongolia and Arabia.  Arabia appeals to my builder side a bit more, but I'm more of a builder type.  A keshig/knight invasion, though would be a sight to behold.  Given the keshig's fast movement rate it might be possible to do that without needing a GG (did I just hear someone shout "heresy!"? )

From a wider perspective, my main motivation to dedlurk here is to learn from someone way better than myself - you're in the driver's seat.

What also makes things a bit ridiculous is that the base ability of a governor takes effect as soon as the governor is placed in the city.  Magnus can just hop and skip all over the place, +100% here, +100% there.  This makes getting districts (and Tier 1 buildings) out a crapton easier as you can almost 1-chop them with good overflow, among other things.  One question to be figured out is whether it's better to get several governors with the first wave of promotions or to get one and promote repeatedly.

I am pretty sure it is just the loyalty that takes effect immediately. The abilities are available once the governor is established.

I thought I had seen someone on CivFanatics say the base ability was also immediate.  Just did a quick test and you're right - it's only the loyalty that moves immediately.  Even so, Magnus is a bit nuts.

[TheArchduke]

I don't really have a preference between Mongolia and Arabia.  Arabia appeals to my builder side a bit more, but I'm more of a builder type.  A keshig/knight invasion, though would be a sight to behold.  Given the keshig's fast movement rate it might be possible to do that without needing a GG (did I just hear someone shout "heresy!"? )

From a wider perspective, my main motivation to dedlurk here is to learn from someone way better than myself - you're in the driver's seat.

I thought I had seen someone on CivFanatics say the base ability was also immediate.  Just did a quick test and you're right - it's only the loyalty that moves immediately.  Even so, Magnus is a bit nuts.

Keshig suffer from a simple problem though, they are not an upgrade path unlike the mamelucks.

And despite the 5turn wait, Magnus is a badass.

If I had any "true" builder civ, I would go for it.

[TheArchduke]

Further testing shows that Magnus is really the way to go here. Get him asap, maybe even with a promotion which does need pop to squeeze out a settler.

Look at this. 3 settlers in 2 turns.

   

I think as soon as we have our capital and the 2nd city site scouted we need a Magnus micro plan. Site 2 should involve stone or at the very least a lot of woods.

[suboptimal]

Depending on the map location, deer could also be used to feed the chops. That type of overflow is going to be powerful -- it's obvious that the early game is going to depend largely upon who uses Magnus to the fullest effect. Any thoughts regarding how the other governors might fit into a gameplan?

Has your experimentation tilted your thinking towards Arabia or Mongolia or is it still a toss up?

[TheArchduke]

It is more a question of if we want to builder (Arabia) or rush (Mongolia).

It boils down to the fact that if Scotland, Korea or Netherlands are taken, they will outbuild us.

But with the tasty choices, we could do an upset win by going for religion and faith and going for it hard (Arabia).

Or let the world burn. (Mongolia)

Sorry for still being in indecision lane here, suboptimal.:D I wish I had a clearer choice.

[TheArchduke]

After a long walk on the weekend, I appreciate my situation a bit more. With no "ideal" civ I have to make my own fortune here and wait for the next game to go farmer´s gambit.

So. Taken our guesses from the page before.

Rowain Zulu.

Rush in the medieval age with Impi and Corpses. Not seeing a rush before that to be honest.

Japper Cree.

Buildertown. With some nasty scouts and maybe pillaging thrown in?

Alhambram Netherlands.

Buildertown.

Chevalier Mal Fet Korea.


Even more buildertown.

Emperor K Rome.

Buildertown with a nasty Legion Rush possible. Still Rome enables you to become dominating without war and be safe through legions.
So probably buildertown.

Alll those civs except for Zulu lend themselves to building. Except for Chevalier (which did some nice war analysis for Oledavy.) I am not impressed by anyone´s track record for war here.

So this would be a slot for Mongolia. But if my analysis holds any water, there are no religious civs here and the track record of religious civs has been underwhelming so far. Arabia can do terrible things with a religion especially with golden age monumentality (civilian units buyable with faith.)

Seriously by now I could throw a die to determine what I play. I will testgame both nations once again and then decide. India is out. I want to decide when I do wars and not be at war when I do not want to.