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OSG-37 - 1ooming Lizards

I have the save and have begun playing my turn set. Lots of things to update and adjust on the first turn -- differences in play styles and things I want to get started. nod Things should go faster for the rest. But I am also dealing with the screenshot format 1oom uses -- I did not have anything on this machine that would handle that format. I think I have that straightened out now, so I can include pictures in my report. Hopefully I will have that up sometime later today.

Teaser:

In the year 2350 of the Ssssla calendar, a new speaker took office to lead the OSG-37 after the previous speaker's sadly early passing. As the new speaker reviewed the state of the galaxy, he found much good news -- the Sakkra people had expanded to six worlds, and were thriving in greater numbers than ever before. But there were signs of trouble on the horizon.... These 'Bulrathi' creatures were going to be a problem.
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Sounds exciting, haphazard!  I'll look forward to the report!

Also, after failing to notice for a couple of days that DaveV had edited a report into his post with the save, I then also forgot to respond to it.  So!

(March 23rd, 2022, 15:15)DaveV Wrote: I couldn't remember the traditional number of turns for the second player, so I went with 15.

That's the right number for the second and third sets, taking us to 2335 and then 2350, yes!  After that, it's all sets of 10.

Quote:I made some changes that are probably sub optimal but that I view as cheap insurance: as Celtsi was finishing its factories, I put the extra production into a bunch of scouts, sending most to the rich world of Obaca, which will open up some more planets for exploration, but also putting a single scout garrison over almost every reachable planet.

Oh, I definitely agree with the choice to build some Scouts; I think I even posted about that in my "notes for the Second Speaker."  Good point also about getting at least a nominal defender over each world.  I wouldn't invest any resources into missile bases as early as you did, mostly because they aren't much good in a fight until we get an upgrade or two to missiles or shields:  I prefer to defend primarily with fleets rather than bases because of their versatility.  Still, both are definitely valuable; a lot depends on what we're facing from enemy fleets.

A good set of turns, including a good, brief discussion of your tech choices (brief, to be clear, is a good thing, even if it's also something I never seem to manage myself).  Not much else to say on that, with the report so short, to the point, and on point!

To jez9999's detailed report with specific questions however, I'll try to reply in more depth ... or rather let other (imaginary) members of the OSG voice their suggestions, because - I fully acknowledge - I am still crazy.

Ssssstah Deessssscho, Newly-Appointed Governor of Rayden:
It's easy to see that the Third Speaker had the right technological priorities:  Without the increased efforts devoted to fuel development prior to Deuterium, we might still be waiting to colonize this world, and the secrets waiting among its ancient ruins would remain entombed even longer beneath their centuries of dust and debris.  The urgency of establishing this vital colony cannot be questioned by any member of the OSG, and I only regret that costruction of the ship that was to found it began on Sssssla when our fuel research completed:  Not only might Celtsi have accomplished the same task still faster, as the Second Speaker indicated, but it would not have gone amiss to begin on the ship even earlier, in anticipation of the fuel we would soon possess.  We couldn't know when deuterium would be available, but when we knew it could happen soon, it would be better to have the ship ready, costing maintenance for a few extra years, than to wait and delay this vital colony for the years it would take to build it.  Then, once the colony was established, I would have appreciated a set of transports from Sssssla immediately, preferable with others already on their way from Kulthos to take the place of most of them:  The faster we get a strong population base here, the sooner we can start truly exploring the remnant artifact-cities left behind by Orion's Ancients.  As for the instructions the Third Speaker gave me as governor of the colony, I fear I must object if the same settings were used here as at Kulthos - where they also seem ill-advised to me.  Not only would I advise against wasting money subsidizing our already-immense rate of breeding, even when (or rather if) our factories ever outstrip our population, but five missile bases - or even one - would be excessive on a world like this one, behind a nebula and tens of parsecs away from any possible enemy.  Future Speakers will be sure to cancel the orders I was given by the Third anyway, but I wanted to voice my objections for the record:  Every planet's needs should be evaluated based on its capabilities and potentials and proximity to the enemy.  In the case of Rayden here, our capabiliites are slight with only the population carried by our original colony ship, but once more Sakkra arrive, our research potential will be immense - so we should get more out here as soon as may be!  And as for our proximity, I doubt if any aliens will set paw or talon here on Rayden, even if it's defenseless, before we know the fate of the galaxy!

Nohssssk Annar, 13-year veteran Governor of Obaca:
Hisssssssssss!!  I am angry and thingsssssssss!!!  Sssssssssso angry at the Third Sssssssssspeaker!  Thisssssss definitely hasssssss nothing to do with the fact that that the fourth is in power now so I don't have to be afraid of retaliation!  Definitely!

Ahem!  But can you believe I was given the same orders as Kulthos?  Kulthos, with so few minerals to its name that it would have been easy to justify choosing not to build factories on it at all, and just leaving its people to research and breed?  Yes, yes, some Sakkra would say it's worth building factories there too, and they may have a point, but it's a matter of debate and of immediate priorities - whereas here, where we can build factories four times as quickly as at Kulthos, and where they'll each have four times the output when we're building defenses, reserves, or fleets, I've been directed to waste our energies on breeding every time our swift factory-building has caught up enough to fully employ our population!  If we're going to pay to grow people that way, far better to let Kulthos do it and ship them down here in transports while we put all our efforts into factories!  And if we don't, and Kulthos doesn't send us anybody, far better for us to build missile bases or a placeholder ship when our factories outstrip our people's needs!  Planetary populations should do the things they're good at, and when you put a governor in charge, the governor's orders should be chosen accordingly!  Never mind that we're doing great anyway and the Third Speaker did a fine job overall and specifically warned us that we were electing someone with very little experience!  I want to hold onto my grievance, and no one can stop me!!!!!

Apart from that though, I'm actually pretty happy with this Third Speaker.  Mrrshan diplomats - no matter how ruthless - are sure to like to trade, and a trade agreement to the tune of just 25 billion won't break the bank even if they declare war on us before it ever turns a profit.  It's going to take a while for that agreement to ever mature or for the Mrrshans to get over their low opinion of our people, but as long as peace holds out, trade will make a little headway toward both every year.  Some might question starting to spy on them immediately - and so heavily - but it can make sense if it can give us information that we need to know quickly, as long as the spending is reduced again once we get our first reports.  In this case, the Mrrshans need only two things to make an attempt at control of our world's rich mines:  Sufficiently advanced fuel cells to cross the distance from here to Crypto, and sufficiently advanced environmental controls for their people to survive here.  By this time, the possibility that they might have acquired both is very real, and learning whether they in fact have done so - and what weapons their ships can mount when once they do - may be of immeasurable value to inform the timing and the nature of our defenses.  Now that our spies have been placed, we can tell that the Mrrshans have the necessary fuel - it was only a matter of time in any case, with Crypto so close - but also that they cannot yet survive on barren worlds such as this, which gives us time enough to build up our infrastructure here before we push our defenses in earnest.  At any time, a new report might tell us the situation has changed - that they might suddenly have reason to take a keener interest in this world - or that they have discovered some other planetological technology, suggesting they are likely further from learning to live here than we otherwise must fear.  Fortunately, by now, as I write this in 2350, we have had time enough to develop that - since our planet's crust is so rich in valuable minerals - we should be able to assemble defenses quickly if need be!

And finally, Admiral Ssssslin Kaway, Governor of the Sssssu Issssadran's Island military colony and pilot school on Sssssla:
Okay, look, the cadets never get this right, and not only because it's the wrong question.  You get some alien missile boat trying to hit you with missiles at long range, and sure, maybe you can dodge 'em.  Trick is to make sure you can get as far away as possible in the missiles' two-impulse travel time and hope the enemy fires when you're just at the edge of their missiles' range; then you gotta make sure you'll still be at the far edge of their range by the time they arrive, and in between, as near as possible, you fly perpendicular to the missiles' path toward you, even back and forth if you have to, so they have to spend that little extra fuel tracking after your changing path and expire just before they reach you.  If you're into waiting to see what they do, you can do that when they've just fired something at you at long range, but not when you've got already tracking toward you, halfway home.  It's dicey, and it works best farthest from the planet - which with our standard display orientation means toward the bottom of the screen.  If you're hanging out down there, sometimes the idiots will stop in the wrong place and fire missiles at you when they think you're barely in range but you're actually just out of range, and you don't even have to do anything but wait 'em out!  But like I say, it's the wrong question.  The Speaker might say a Scout is cheap and you might as well give it a go on the chance you escape the missiles and get your scans in, but I value our pilot's lives, and I say, if you're on your own in one little ship against a fleet of two cruisers of different designs, and ten destroyers besides, the way you dodge any missiles they happen to send your way is to retreat into hyperspace!  The chances that a fleet like that has nothing but missiles to kill you with, and that they'll fire all of them at you from far enough out you can trick 'em all, is pretty much the same as nothing.

I hope some of this is helpful!
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(March 26th, 2022, 23:15)RefSteel Wrote: I hope some of this is helpful!
Very helpful, thanks! A couple of extra things...

Quote:Kulthos, with so few minerals to its name that it would have been easy to justify choosing not to build factories on it at all, and just leaving its people to research and breed?  Yes, yes, some Sakkra would say it's worth building factories there too, and they may have a point, but it's a matter of debate and of immediate priorities
Right... so let's get into the detail. Specifically, in this situation, why is it worse to build factories on Kulthos - even with its being mineral poor - and get the extra benefit from them in the long run? Not obvious at all to me. Again, maybe it's something you get an instinct for after playing the game for 1000 hours. smile

Quote:In this case, the Mrrshans need only two things to make an attempt at control of our world's rich mines:  Sufficiently advanced fuel cells to cross the distance from here to Crypto, and sufficiently advanced environmental controls for their people to survive here.  By this time, the possibility that they might have acquired both is very real, and learning whether they in fact have done so - and what weapons their ships can mount when once they do - may be of immeasurable value to inform the timing and the nature of our defenses.  Now that our spies have been placed, we can tell that the Mrrshans have the necessary fuel - it was only a matter of time in any case, with Crypto so close - but also that they cannot yet survive on barren worlds such as this, which gives us time enough to build up our infrastructure here before we push our defenses in earnest.
If they had gotten the tech to land on Obaca though, what would the appropriate defence be? Ships with laser weapons on? What mark computer, what shield level, what hull size, how many? Even knowing their tech levels, how do you decide this, through anything more objective than a gut instinct having played the game 1000 times already?
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Lots of good points from RefSteel. (And not just because I agree with them. nod) Sorry for the delay in getting my turns played, I am working on getting my report ready. A few quick thoughts:

- Factories on poor planets

In the long term we will probably want to industrialize Kulthos. But due to its poor minerals, it will be a very slow process and expensive. Early in the game it is more useful to use poor planets as population sources to seed other worlds, and also get whatever trickle of research from them that you can while other better worlds are busy building factories and colony ships. Once our core worlds have max factories and can support research, then we can (slowly) add factories to Kulthos.

Another factor to consider is that poor worlds are difficult to defend, as bases and planetary shields (already expensive on normal worlds) are hard to contruct. If you build factories, you give AIs an opportunity to get techs from easy conquests. No factories, no risk of tech losses.

Ultra poor worlds are almost never worth building factories at all.

- Dodging missiles

I am no good at this myself, and almost never attempt it.
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OK, turnset played. Overall things went well, but I found the governor extremely frustrating. There has to be a way to turn it off completely, right? Surely there is a way to do this? Having it change my spending and lock and unlock my sliders every single turn is ridiculous. The 1oom doc files mention that it can be disabled for individual planets, but I could not figure out how to do this. frown Clicking on the planet name in the galaxy map just moves/scrolls the screen. And opening the extra menu allows changing the governor settings, but does not seem to support just turning the damn thing off. It is like those stupid assisted driving cars that keep jostling your elbow as you try to focus on traffic around you. frown

Full report to follow, but quick summary: we added two new colonies, researched some new tech, avoided wars, developed our worlds, and grew lots of new lizards. smile

RefSteel - UP now!
DaveV
jez9999
haphazard1 - just finished

Save is (I hope!) attached.


Attached Files
.zip   OSG37_2360_save6.zip (Size: 4.96 KB / Downloads: 2)
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(March 27th, 2022, 14:00)haphazard1 Wrote: OK, turnset played. Overall things went well, but I found the governor extremely frustrating. There has to be a way to turn it off completely, right? Surely there is a way to do this? Having it change my spending and lock and unlock my sliders every single turn is ridiculous. The 1oom doc files mention that it can be disabled for individual planets, but I could not figure out how to do this. frown Clicking on the planet name in the galaxy map just moves/scrolls the screen. And opening the extra menu allows changing the governor settings, but does not seem to support just turning the damn thing off. It is like those stupid assisted driving cars that keep jostling your elbow as you try to focus on traffic around you. frown

Left-click on the planet name in the top-right to toggle it on/off.
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As the new speaker for the OSG-37 reviewed the reports and information his predecessor had left for him, he was pleased with the overall position of the Sakkra in the galaxy. The people were flourishing on six worlds now, and his predecessor had two colony ships already moving to add more worlds where future generations would live. There was much work to be done, however, and several looming concerns for the future. The years ahead would be busy ones....

[Image: 2350-map.jpg]

A large concern were the Bulrathi, who just in the past handful of years have added multiple worlds to their empire. The bears now have 6 worlds, the same as we currently have. While several of their worlds are quite new and undeveloped, the bears are going to be very strong down the road.

The cats only have three worlds. We know from my predecessor's scouting reports that the Alkari are due south of us, with their homeworld presumably being the yellow star south of the Mrrshan. Given distances between stars in that area, hopefully the birds are not too powerful. That leaves the Klackons and Psilons to be in that triple yellow cluster or the farthest east yellow; it would probably be better if they were both in the triplet and stunted each other's growth.

[Image: 2350-races.jpg]

We have small trade deals with both races we are in contact with, which will help improve relations over time. We also have current spying reports on their tech. But we are also spending a LOT on spying. Now that we have current info, I drop the spy spending to zero. We do not want to risk active spying right now while we are essentially defenseless and might trigger an attack if we get caught. The existing spies will be eliminated in a few years, but we can always spend again later for updated reports. For now, we need those funds elsewhere.

[Image: 2350-status.jpg]

For this point in an impossible game, things look pretty decent. The bears having that many worlds is a worry, and that tech bar looks bad.

[Image: 2350-bears.jpg]

Range 6? Death spores? The bears are looking strong tech-wise. Bears with toys are dangerous. We will need to keep a close eye on these aggressive expansionists.

[Image: 2350-cats.jpg]

The kitties have drawn an unusual personality for them; ruthless is normal but diplomats? Hmmmm, maybe they will be a bit easier to get along with. But any treaty violations will be strongly negative with them. Note the personal deflector shield -- the cats will be strong on the ground. And no planetology tech at all in 2350? Ouch.

I send half of Kulthos' pop to our newly settled artifacts world of Rayden. Due to the nebula they will take a while to get there, so Rayden is going to be very slow getting developed. frown I could send pop from Sssla and replace from Kulthos, but it would only save one or two turns overall while disrupting our homeworld for three turns.

And speaking of our homeworld, it is 2350 and it has not maxed its factories yet. eek I shift spending to address this immediately. I also adjust spending priorities around the empire:

- Mineral-poor Kulthos stops spending on factories and pushes research instead, to help make up for Sssla reducing research to build factories
- Mineral-rich Celtsi starts feeding the reserves, to provide funds to help our newer planets develop faster
- Any spending on population growth is eliminated (including governor settings for such). We are the Sakkra! We breed fast as it is, and we need those funds elsewhere.

For tech, I rebalance spending to advance in fields other than propulsion. We would like range 6, but it is a modest upgrade from range 5 and is quite expensive. We will continue working on propulsion, but it will no longer be dominating our research spending.

I also shift a couple scouts around to make sure we have something over every world. If the AIs want to scan our worlds and gain visibility, they will have to at least send an armed ship. No freebies!

Finally done with the first turn (which is often the longest in an SG turnset), I hit end turn and start advancing the clock.
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Thanks for the tip, jez9999!

Hmmm, not sure why my screenshots are showing up so small. frown Something happening in the process of converting from the pcx format and then uploading. frown I will try to find a solution for this. But I want to get the report at least posted, so RefSteel will have the current status of everything and what happened.
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(Until I can get the problems with picture size worked out, this will be a written report only. frown Sorry for the problems.)

A couple quiet years pass with factories being built, tech being researched, and new generations of lizards being hatched. With money in the reserve from Celtsi, I start boosting spending at our newer worlds, focusing mostly on Reticuli and Rayden. Obaca is rich and is building factories quite well on its own.

In 2353, one year before our colony ship is due to reach Kronos, a Bulrathi fleet arrives in the system -- two bear colony ships! eek Fortunately, they are still unarmed, and retreat from our single scout. smile I begin building some basic pop gun laser fights at Celtsi and reloc them through Sssla to defend Kronos. They will not be much defense against any serious attack, but they may prevent the bears from getting a free scan and sending an invasion force.

At the other end of our empire, we settle a new colony at desert Xengara in the southwest. I send half of Kulthos' population to seed the new world. We also scout Vulcan, a size 10 radiated planet in the northern Bulrathi empire zone. Yeah, I think they can have that one...if they can settle it. Also, Sssla finally maxes its factories. Rather late, but at least it is done. nod

The following year lizards everywhere celebrate as we colonize Kronos for our eighth world. dance Once again I send half of Kulthos' population. That poor planet is going to be empty at the rate I keep sending its people elsewhere. lol

A quick check of diplomatic relations shows trade is slowly boosting positive feelings with the bears and cats. We still have active spies with each, and a look at the reports shows the cats have researched Hyper-V missiles. Also, they and the bears are now allied. Previously the cats were allied with the birds, but that has ended. The early game AI cheese alliances can be a real pain for the human player. frown

Speaking of cheese alliances, in 2357 a Bulrathi scout appears at newly-colonized Xengara in the west. This is a long way from bear space. Fortunately our scout forces the bear scout to retreat before it can scan the system, so no bear invasion force will be heading for our new colony.

That same year, Sakkra scientists complete research into Class 2 Deflectors. smile Our planetary bases will be safe from regular lasers. Our choices are Deflectors 3 or Personal Deflectors -- with powerful bears in the galaxy I choose the gropo tech.

The following year our researchers make another breakthrough with Deep Space Scanner. We still have ECM1 available; the only choice to advance is Improved Robotic Controls 3. I gladly select IRC3; by the time it is researched all our core worlds should have max factories and be ready for upgrading.

In 2359 our spies report that the Bulrathi have developed Merculite Missiles. frown The bears are going to be very dangerous. Meanwhile, trade has improved relations with the Mrrshan to Relaxed. You don't see that too often as the Sakkra.

My turnset closes with our scientists reporting another discovery: Gatling Lasers. As options for the future we have Anti-missile Rockets, Fusion Bombs, and Ion Cannon. I consider Fusion Bombs, which are very useful until Planetary Shield X comes into use, but decide to go with Ion Cannon. With no missile upgrades so far cry, we are going to need capable ship-to-ship weapons to maintain control of our territory.

For our next speaker:

- The population meant to seed artifacts world Rayden has been hugely delayed by the nebula. frown The world has grown naturally from those two starting pop into the high teens -- Sakkra pop growth is amazing. lol
- We have a decent chunk of cash in the reserves.
- We have a small force of laser pop guns at Kronos, but if the bears come at us in force we will be in trouble there.

Good luck!
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(March 27th, 2022, 16:19)haphazard1 Wrote: That same year, Sakkra scientists complete research into Class 2 Deflectors. smile Our planetary bases will be safe from regular lasers.
Does that mean they'll take zero damage from regular lasers? The class 2 deflectors are meant to absorb 2 damage per hit, but can't lasers do up to 4 damage points?

Quote:Our choices are Deflectors 3 or Personal Deflectors -- with powerful bears in the galaxy I choose the gropo tech.
What is gropo?

Quote:In 2359 our spies report that the Bulrathi have developed Merculite Missiles. frown The bears are going to be very dangerous.
I've seen various people expressing concern over Merculite Missiles. Why are they in particular so dangerous? They just seem to be one in a long line of missile and torpedo upgrades, from the manual.
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