[NO PLAYERS] Here be Dragons: Lurker and Map-making Thread

[RefSteel]

Quickly posting since I have no time at the moment but would love to get feedback in case anyone has a chance to offer any:

[EDIT: Superseded; see below![

[RefSteel]

First-pass revisions to all the starts; any comments or observations would help!

[EDIT: All starts updated further; see below]

[Jabah]

C might be a bit low on food, with fthe cow out of range if SIP.

[RefSteel]

Thanks, Jabah! I've now moved the cow into the BFC and made some other changes to several of the other starts as well:

Start B:

(The corn is connected to fresh water even though it doesn't look like it.)

Start C:

[EDIT: Start D updated below.]

Start E:

[EDIT: Start F updated below.]

[Qgqqqqq]

River grass
A: 3, 4 post mining
B: 3, 1fp, 1 post mining
C: 3, 1fp
D: 3, 1fp
E: 3, 1 post mining
F: 3

Food:
A: 5 ag, 5/6 AH (+1h)
B: 6 ag, 5/3 AH (+3h)
C: 5ag, 5/3 AH (+3h)
D:6ag, 5/3hnt (+4h)
E: 6ag, 4/4/4 AH (+4h)
F: 5/4 ag, 4/4 hnt (+3h)


Can't recall the c difference between incense and gems and gold off the top of my head. One thing I'd note is that Calendar is generally easier to get than mining (ignoring the boosted start nature).

Analysis: without looking beyond the starts, late game A feels a cut above the rest for a capital. D and especially F feels a bit worse - hunting is quite a bit more beakers than AH. I might be undervaluing the 4fh start though. F in particular is missing a power food tile by comparison to others.

[RefSteel]

Thanks so much for looking over the starts, Q! I've updated A, D, and F accordingly, hopefully bringing them more into line with the others.

Start A:

Start D:

Start F:

[RefSteel]

Oh, also, here are some sets of leader and civ options rolled up so they can be quickly connected to random starts and players with just two (or three, counting the roll for starting player) total die rolls:

Alpha:
Decius (Organized, Raiders) of the Bannor, with Cartography OR Fishing OR Hunting
Averax the Cambion (Aggressive, Barbarian, Expansive) of the Sheaim, with Mysticism
Perpentach (Arcane, Charismatic, Creative, Insane) of the Balseraphs, with Animal Husbandry OR Calendar

Beta:
Falamar (Charismatic, Expansive) of the Lanun, with Cartography OR Fishing OR Hunting
Cassiel (Philosophical, Industrious, Adaptive) of the Grigori, with Mining OR Masonry
Charadon (Aggressive, Charismatic, Barbarian) of the Doviello, with no additional tech

Gamma:
Flauros (Creative/Financial) of the Calabim, with Cartography OR Fishing OR Hunting
Ethne the White (Creative, Organized) of the Elohim, with Mysticism
Tasunke (Aggressive, Raiders) of the Hippus, with Animal Husbandry OR Calendar

Delta:
Dain the Caswallawn (Arcane, Philosophical) of the Amurites, with Mysticism
Beeri Bawl (Financial, Industrious) of the Luchuirp, with Mining OR Masonry
Cardith Lorda (Philosophical, Expansive, Adaptive) of the Kuriotates, with Animal Husbandry OR Calendar

Epsilon:
Varn Gosam (Spiritual/Creative/Adaptive) of the Malakim, with Mysticism
Auric Ulvin (Charismatic, Arcane, Agnostic) of the Illians, with Cartography OR Fishing OR Hunting
Faeryl Viconia (Arcane, Raiders) of the Svartalfar, with Animal Husbandry OR Calendar

Zeta:
Shekinah (Creative, Arcane) of the Sidar, with Mysticism
Thessa (Expansive, Arcane) of the Ljosalfar, with Cartography OR Fishing OR Hunting
Jonas Endain (Spiritual/Expansive) of the Clan of Embers, with no additional tech

[Erasmas]

Hah, both Coldrain and Auro started their thread with "Here we go again". I suspect a mindfuck by the "Here be Dragons" .

[RefSteel]

And two random.org list sorts gives me:

DaveV - A - Epsilon
Mr Cairo - E - Delta
BING_XI_LAO - C - Alpha
xist10 - B - Zeta
Aurorarcher - D - Beta
coldrain - F - Gamma

I'll try to post these accordingly.

[RefSteel]

Posting the map here in case someone has a chance to look at it. Starts should be in the correct order, but with random civs, signs for start positions still in place, and completely wrong starting units, all to be fixed when players lock in their civs. Another advantage of posting it here: If I disappear off the face of the forum for some reason, a random lurker should easily be able to change the civs and units, remove the excess signs, and get the game started!

All suggestions are welcome; even though I'm trying not to spend too much effort on balancing the map (partly because I don't have time, partly because I still wouldn't know where to start when balancing FfH) I don't want anyone to win or lose the game from turn 0(/1) if I can avoid it.

Okay, one exception: Please don't comment on any player-specific stuff. For instance, I don't know if Auro's start has unusually few or numerous coast tiles in range for Lanun, and I don't know how close xist is to the jungles (something he didn't like in the last game). I tried from the beginning to make sure no one was truly jungle choked and that everyone would have good access to water and islands, and if I failed to do that for one or more of the starts, regardless of whose, please do let me know which start letter has the problem. Not all the starts will be equal though, and I'm trying to continue keeping the players and starts separate in my mind.

Thanks in advance for any comments at all, whether I end up able to do anything about them or not!