So you want to learn about Ground Pounding?

[Bam-Bam]

For a look into how the galaxy's ground pounders, the Bulrathi, play, have a read of my first solo game report Da Bears! over at my website.

Fun game, and I hope you enjoy reading it as much as I enjoyed playing it. Now on to Imperium 1.

[barron of ideas]

Bears with computers, what a concept.

I don't think the Bulrathi usually get to steal as much stuff as you did, through spying. And of course trading when you don't have much to trade is pretty challenging, too. Don't they usually conquer their new technology? Which you did very well, too.

Was this on Impossible? Just checked, it was "just" hard. As an "Average" player myself, I am impressed. You made it look pretty simple. I'm not sure I would take a no missle tech chart to victory the way you did.

Good job, thanks for the lesson. I think everyone can develop superior ground troops through research, if you get the right techs in your pool, and can afford to research them, rather than something else. It seems to be a substitute for missles, just send in the clowns, er infantry. Helps if you can clone them or did that happen too late to have an effect on the game?

[Charis]

Bam Bam,

Thanks for the AAR, that was an interesting read, and about anything I read at this point
is helpful. It was easy to follow and lots of pictures, so well done! B)

However, may I point out something that's perhaps more a response to the title of your post
than anything wrong with the report. Maybe this is something that will help other good players who
are here to be even more instructive for us newbs!

I didn't actually find the post too instructive. If the point was to tell what happened, in a way other
good players could follow and understand, it reached that goal and well. But there's a difference between
an action report and something we which will help others "learn about ground pounding".

Just to be clear what I meant, without wanting to 'pick on' the report, here are some examples of what I mean.

> Well, being the only race with poor research on computers makes for interesting times, let me tell you.
It did, but what did you do about that? How did that effect your tech plan or expansion plan. What difference did being poor in computers make? (You ended up lucky in computer steals :P )

> For my first tech choices, I take deep space scanner and ... and ....
Most tech choices, like this one, are 'reports'. As a newb I kept asking "Why?" "WHY?" "WHY???"

> I poach a steppe planet, Crypto, from the Silicoids in the east by a mere two years...
Did you mean to, or just luck out? Why that planet? Why did you send ships when you did. Since you knew they would return with a force, what did you do about it? The report suggests you did absolutely nothing
and were a passive react-or to whatever they did "They send 49 colonists against my reinforced 16."

> Inertial Stabilizers come in next, giving me a tough choice between warp 3 or range 7. Speed it is.
Why??? What benefit did that give you? How did it fit Da Bears strategy?

> Aha! Time for the first vote. ... I barely excape losing the vote.
Adds tension to the report to know this, but... what did you do about it? Did you watch passively and become sadder as each vote went past. When did you realize that if you did nothing you were GOING to lose, and what did you do? (These aren't academic questions, but a reflection of on one of my first games where I had no point of reference to be able to answer these questions)

> Of course, the Mrrshans get uppity, declaring a hot war... I talk to the humans....
What's the connection? Was there a connection, or just reporting two non-related events? Did you
seek an alliance? Did you hope to find a tech you would need to meet this threat? Why did you talk to the humans?

> Klackons come with bio weapons to Crypto--everyone's favorite target. My defenses hold before too
> much damage is done, and I am left with a population of 25.

Did you see them coming? How did you react? What defenses did you have? What ships did they bring? What difference did your ground pounding ability give you? (Did it come to a ground war?) Do you see the picture here - the report makes it seem that you are a passive agent being rocked around, to and fro, without much control over your destiny. I don't think (???) that's the case, but I can't come to any other conclusion on the basis of the report. I point this out not to question your skill, rather to say... as a newbie I am prone to actually be that passive race coasting through the game as the game plays him, reacting, not readying, defending, not crafting defenses. If I don't understand a LOT more of the "why" in the game from other people's reports they are just stories, giving a sense of "that's nice... for him" rather than "OH!! That's what you do about .... In my next game I'm gonig to watch for that!" Not a formula of moves or techs, but greater understanding.

> I manage to steal construction tech 9 from the Klackons
I don't even know how to steal! Press the espionage button? (I said I was a newb!! )
How do I gauge my chances? How likely is a failed event to lead to death of spies, or worse, a hot war?
How would I find out WHAT I want to steal? Or from who? Why "construction tech 9?" Was that something very important that allowed you some needed benefit? Or did you just feel like doing a steal from someone, anyone, and that's the one you ended up taking after you saw the steal was a success.

> Time to payback the bugs for Tauri. My huge ion cannon ship, along with a couple of large ion cannon
> ships wins the day, and I take Phyco and controlled radiated from the bugs.

Payback? Was payback your motivation? Why did you want that planet back? How did you gauge your chances? How did you know (or think) that your ships would be enough? What was your ion cannon design and what vital tradeoff decisions did you make in designing it? How did it fit the fact that you were "Da Bears" and going after the Klackons? Once you took Phyco, how did you defend it? Did you? Or did it become a hot potato? :P

> Next the final composition of the Bulrathi fleet.

I don't understand your fleet choices AT ALL. Why 522 ships with a single missile? (Why do they all have Inertial Stabilizers, btw? Is that a must-have item once you research it?) The gladiator design looks awfully similar to the sentinal. Why no lasers whatsoever? 1126 ships with a battle scanner?????? Don't you need just one (one per attack squadron anyway) Why are you only using 4 designs? (Recently scrapped scout and colony?) Why are three of them so close together in price? I would have guessed maybe you would have one very cheap class in huge number, a more expensive one that is a main fighter, a set of large ships that pack a big punch, and a smaller number of huge uber ships. Dunno, just guessing.

On the Civ3 SG scene, I tend to have verbose reports, but most of the time I make a special effort to explain the reason for my choices, and more than that, what I am looking at to evaluate the situation and come up with a plan at the start of my turn. The more I explain things I think are obscenely simple, the more I get folks delurking to thank me, or the more PM's I get saying how they're learning a TON from our SG game and my reports. That's why I do it. I'm *not* one of the best players in that realm, but I do like to think that I'm having a big impact in others become much better players :war:

Again, an enjoyable read, and if you have don't wish to try to instruct that's fine. It takes easily 2-3 times as long to write a didactic report as an action report. But if you or any other of the fine players here are capable writers and interested in sharing a lot more of the "why", know two things: i) such reports will be goldmines for less advanced players (I'm not sure how many folks understand just HOW good Sirian's tutorial and combat reports are, since they talk about stuff that is old hat to most of you!, ii) when done as an Epic report, giving more of your thinking will let better players than you give concrete suggestions that will help your game. (Speaking of succession games, I have the very strong feeling that this game will be *very well suited* for SG format, and that joining in such a game would acceleate the learning and the fun about twenty fold! Prod! )

I still need to learn more about ground pounding!

Thanks,
Charis

[Bam-Bam]

EDIT--this should have all the content added now.

However, may I point out something that's perhaps more a response to the title of your post
than anything wrong with the report. Maybe this is something that will help other good players who
are here to be even more instructive for us newbs!

I didn't actually find the post too instructive. If the point was to tell what happened, in a way other
good players could follow and understand, it reached that goal and well. But there's a difference between
an action report and something we which will help others "learn about ground pounding".

Just to be clear what I meant, without wanting to 'pick on' the report, here are some examples of what I mean.

I realized this after I posted the title, that I was being too presumptive, and then learned I could not edit the title of my post. My bad (insert blush smiley here). Sorry for the overly bold title, but I will try to answer all of your questions. For one--the story was mostly meant as an AAR--not a tutorial. I can see now that I reported events and perhaps did not fully explain WHY I did what I did. Let me try to correct that here.

Well, being the only race with poor research on computers makes for interesting times, let me tell you.  It did, but what did you do about that? How did that effect your tech plan or expansion plan. What difference did being poor in computers make? (You ended up lucky in computer steals  )

I made a point to prioitize computer research--at almost all times, computer research was 50% or more higher than other branches, up until the point at which it started leading my fields (I think that was after I stole Robots IV from the kitties). After that, computers was generally at least equal to my mort prioritized tech. Another thing that benefitted was that I was in a whole lot of wars--from the first declaration--there was not a point in the game at which I was not at war, which meant I was spying on someone ALL the time.

As far as early tech choices, let's take a look.

>Deep space scanner vs. ECM II--I had already gotten Computers II from the artifacts world, and I prefer the ability to see ships in transit over ECM tech. I generally find ECM overrated--vs. missile bases. The missile boats I ended up using were successful when they could pack a punch and get off shots first. ECM was icing on the cake. I would take scanners over ECM 90=% of the time.

>Hand lasers vs. Gatling lasers. This is a quick tech for more ground pounding power, vs. 4 shot at a time laser. Lasers offensive power is EXTREMELY limited in usefullness, and I was not aiming for an early gunship or early claim wars.

The rest of the early techs were my only choices.

I poach a steppe planet, Crypto, from the Silicoids in the east by a mere two years...
Did you mean to, or just luck out? Why that planet? Why did you send ships when you did. Since you knew they would return with a force, what did you do about it? The report suggests you did absolutely nothing
and were a passive react-or to whatever they did "They send 49 colonists against my reinforced 16.

After I got the range 4 tech, I priorited getting the artifacts planet to the west. I had scout 2s parked everywhere, so I was rushing colony ships as fast as I could out of Ursa (home world) to beat the AIs to worlds after shooing there unarmed scouts and unarmed colony ships. I HAD to settle Tauri to the east to get to the Steppe planet. I got lucky, because I had prioritized settling the fertile world on the human border first. As far as the ground combat went, I sent colonists right after I settled (that's what gave the "reinforced 16"), and they arrived at the same time as the silicoid fleet. I kept sending colonists to attempt reinforcements, and lost quite a few to the AI fleets. I was also putting money from the kitty into that planet (what little I had) and upping spending on econ to TRY and buy a few more bears.

> Inertial Stabilizers come in next, giving me a tough choice between warp 3 or range 7. Speed it is.
Why??? What benefit did that give you? How did it fit Da Bears strategy?

At this point, I have a pretty good landgrab, with about 8 or nine planets. Additional range tech could get me some more worlds, but I will likely need some more controlled environment tech to make a difference. Warp 3 (over current Warp 1) will give more bang for the buck.

> Aha! Time for the first vote. ... I barely excape losing the vote.
Adds tension to the report to know this, but... what did you do about it? Did you watch passively and become sadder as each vote went past. When did you realize that if you did nothing you were GOING to lose, and what did you do? (These aren't academic questions, but a reflection of on one of my first games where I had no point of reference to be able to answer these questions)

The first several votes, there was basically nothing I could do. I was getting declared on by just about everyone, so I was just trying to survive, hoping that at least one race would abstain. I did get some good choices for planetology tech (+20 terraforming, and more importantly, soil enrichment), that allowed me to bump up my population such that I only needed one AI to vote for me or abstain. My diplomacy in this game was limited (not that I am a diplomacy expert, mind you). With two ruthless AIs and a xenophobe, there wasn't a whole lot to work with in the early going.

Of course, the Mrrshans get uppity, declaring a hot war... I talk to the humans....
What's the connection? Was there a connection, or just reporting two non-related events? Did you
seek an alliance? Did you hope to find a tech you would need to meet this threat? Why did you talk to the humans?

Sorry--unrelated event. I tried to edit the report last evening before posting to eliminate stream of consciousness, but was not wholly successful. As far as why I was talking to the humans, I was trying to shore up one of my borders, since I had that exposed dead rich planet (Phyco) up there in human land, and robots III (more needed computer tech--and a good production boon) was worth making a trade of a valuable inertial stabilizer tech.

> Klackons come with bio weapons to Crypto--everyone's favorite target. My defenses hold before too
> much damage is done, and I am left with a population of 25.

Did you see them coming? How did you react? What defenses did you have? What ships did they bring? What difference did your ground pounding ability give you? (Did it come to a ground war?) Do you see the picture here - the report makes it seem that you are a passive agent being rocked around, to and fro, without much control over your destiny. I don't think (???) that's the case, but I can't come to any other conclusion on the basis of the report. I point this out not to question your skill, rather to say... as a newbie I am prone to actually be that passive race coasting through the game as the game plays him, reacting, not readying, defending, not crafting defenses. If I don't understand a LOT more of the "why" in the game from other people's reports they are just stories, giving a sense of "that's nice... for him" rather than "OH!! That's what you do about .... In my next game I'm gonig to watch for that!" Not a formula of moves or techs, but greater understanding.

This was pure missile base defense. Remember--I was able to trade with the Silicoids for Hyper X missiles right after the start of the Human and Klackon wars. I poured lots of money into defense to get my Class V shields up and some bases built. As for the Klackon attack at Crypto--with missile bases, you have scanners at your planet, and can scan the enemy fleet. I noticed that the Klackon fleet had no missiles or bombs, and I had Class V planetary shields up. Therefore, their ships could not harm me. except for the ones with bio weapons. I concentrated on the bio-weapons ships, but a few got through and bombed away until they were dead. Close call--at that point, those ships were the biggest worry for the Klackon war. Again--trading for Hyper-X (along with researching Class V planet shields) was the saviour for the initial human and Klackon war. Otherwise I would have lost some more core worlds to invasion or bio bombardment. It really pays to scan the enemy ships and determine where to concentrate fire. When the humans attacked--they had bombs and missiles, large ships and a huge ship. I could not put enough hurt on any of their ships before they obliterated my defenses. Eventually, they brought enought bombers to obliterate the colony.

> I manage to steal construction tech 9 from the Klackons
I don't even know how to steal! Press the espionage button? (I said I was a newb!! )
How do I gauge my chances? How likely is a failed event to lead to death of spies, or worse, a hot war?
How would I find out WHAT I want to steal? Or from who? Why "construction tech 9?" Was that something very important that allowed you some needed benefit? Or did you just feel like doing a steal from someone, anyone, and that's the one you ended up taking after you saw the steal was a success.

You need to click to up the spending to get networks installed. You can have the spies hide, commit sabotage, or commit espionage. Every turn there is a roll made by the defender, modified by the amount of internal security, the difference in computer tech and racial preference (Darloks get +30 to spying and +20 to internal security rolls.) Check out the manual (you can download it from John Sullivan's site, which explains in detail how spying works. Once you get a successful roll, and can steal a technology, you get to pick from one or several fields, depending on what is available and the technology level roll you make. For most of the initial successful attempts, I was taking all computer tech. In this particular instance, I had hoped to capitalize on the Klackon's bonus in construction tech. I must have made a low roll for technology (you roll a number between 1 and the highest level tech available to determine which one you steal in the field). I inserted the :rolleyes: because my choice of fields didn't give me anything significant. What I am not sure about is whether you make one technology level roll that covers all the possible branches, or if one is made after you make your branch selection. I try to stay current on what is available from each of my enemies, (click "report" from the racial screen, then choose the AI you wish to see), so that I know which branch to pick when a spy is successful--you do not get a chance to see what they have before you choose.

> Time to payback the bugs for Tauri. My huge ion cannon ship, along with a couple of large ion cannon
> ships wins the day, and I take Phyco and controlled radiated from the bugs.

Payback? Was payback your motivation? Why did you want that planet back? How did you gauge your chances? How did you know (or think) that your ships would be enough? What was your ion cannon design and what vital tradeoff decisions did you make in designing it? How did it fit the fact that you were "Da Bears" and going after the Klackons? Once you took Phyco, how did you defend it? Did you? Or did it become a hot potato?

No. It wasn't just revenge. The bugs overextended themselves when they settled my former world (it was bombed into dust by the humans). They had built factories, but did not have any planet shields or bases up. I had already been building a huge ship to counter the human huge ship, so that was able to overwhelm the small fleet thay had in place. Since I took the planet and it had factories, I also took some tech. My huge ship had good shields (Class III, I think, decent computers III or IV) and as many ion cannons (my best beam weapon available at the time) as I could fit onto her. There wasn't a whole lot of tradeoff--I needed something with comparable hitpoints to the human huge ship. Phyco ended up becoming my second best producer--next to my desert rich world. Right after I took the planet, I poured some of my treasury into the world. It was rich, and already had 84 factories from the bugs. By the time they sent their slow fleet of small ion ships, I had a planetary shield and 4 bases. They took out my fleet, but the ion cannons could not dent the Class V planet shield with Class V shields on the bases.

> Next the final composition of the Bulrathi fleet.

I don't understand your fleet choices AT ALL. Why 522 ships with a single missile? (Why do they all have Inertial Stabilizers, btw? Is that a must-have item once you research it?) The gladiator design looks awfully similar to the sentinal. Why no lasers whatsoever? 1126 ships with a battle scanner?????? Don't you need just one (one per attack squadron anyway) Why are you only using 4 designs? (Recently scrapped scout and colony?) Why are three of them so close together in price? I would have guessed maybe you would have one very cheap class in huge number, a more expensive one that is a main fighter, a set of large ships that pack a big punch, and a smaller number of huge uber ships. Dunno, just guessing.

Aha. You are seeing the technique of missile boats. Pound for pound, in the middle game, if you have a good missile (stinger or above) and decent engines, a medium ship loaded with one 5count missile and as much speed as you can muster (that means best engines, high maneuverability, and inertial stabilizers) along with good computers will give you the punch to start on the offensive. That's not a 100% true for all cases, but for all the opponents I faced, that Warp 4 missile boat did the trick in starting the snowball. It did NOTHING against the Klackon worlds at the time--they had Class X planetary shields, and Class V or above regular shields. I was able to whittle down their huge fleet of small ships. There was no benfit in putting beam weapons on these missile boats--they are hit and run... Run in, get off your five missiles, and try to evade as many shooters and enemy missiles as possible. Speed and initiative are key. You want to be able to get the first shot in, which means good computers. The 2nd gen stinger boat had Warp 5 engines,and thus faster strategic and combat speed, better shields, and some ECM, since it was a base hunter.

As for the numbers--that's a bit deceiving. Those are the final numbers. I probably built similar numbers of 1st and 2nd gen stinger boats, but the Mrrshans put a hurting on one of my 2nd gen stinger fleets. I also pushed those to finish off the Mrrshans, so they saw higher attrition than the 1st Gen design. I think I stated in the report that the decision to push to something beyond the missile boats was when I got Warp 6 engines and took High Energy Focus (+3 to beam and particle weapon range). I put battle scanners on the new missile boat (which was real nice to have two 5c missiles, even if one was dated), to give it more initiative. They could operate with or independent of the large gunships.

As far as why only four--I only design and build what I need. These were the only four ship designs that I mass produced--I probably made 1K each of the missile boat designs. When I started on the gunship and herculite/stinger missile boats, I chose to build the boats at my normal world (basically any normal world with pop above 135M, except Cryslon, which was pumping out troopers) I would get between two and four of the gunships per year, and 40-50 missile boats, IIRC.

About the ground pounding....generally, ground pounding is much harder with other races. The +25 is tremendous. Ground combat is d100 (according to the manual) for each combatant, with the defender getting +5. The scores are compared, and the loser loses a troop (both lose for a tie). With other races, coordinated troops from 2 or 3 or 4 (sometimes 5) worlds are needed to take a fully developed 100+ world when the defender has some advantage. Plus, you want the new world to make quick use of those factories, so having 50 colonists left at the end of the combat means that the new acquisition can get up to speed with factories/shields and bases more quickly, allowing you to divert your fleet elsewhere, or boost that fleet in case an enemy SoD is on the way. Until advanced scanners, you cannot send troopers to a world in which you have not scouted. That factor puts even more emphasis on early scouting and denial of AI scouting by fanning out the scouts. If you can scout all the nearby worlds, then even if you lose out on the initial settling, you will be more readily able to swoop in and grab a world if the AI has overextended.

That's where capturing tech is such a powerful game mechanism--and NOT dependent (for the most part) on dice rolls. You need to be able to put together a winning fleet and ground team to take a world. That may mean temporary local supremacy--but you just might get a key tech to enable you to crawl back into the game, or blow the game open. If things work out, you may be able to get the colony up fast enough to counter the AI SoD with missile bases, even if you have a ghost fleet (that's exactly what happened to me vs. the Klackons at Phyco, that rich dead world.) I also took back my poor world with factories (getting more tech), and did not fret too much when the AI burnt it down. Those three techs were way more valuable than a poor world.

Planetology techs are invaluable to good ground assault. Having all your worlds be fertile (+50% growth, soil enrich tech) or gaia (+100% growth--adv soil enrich) allows for faster regrowth of soldiers. +xx terreforming gives you a larger base. Atmospheric takes hostile worlds and makes then normal, where they then can be enriched with soil enrichement techs. Cloning and advanced closing make the cost of growing a colonist drop to 10 bc (from 20bc) and 5bc, respectively. That is why I like the standard bent of the bulrathis to environmentalist, even though they have no particular bonus to planetology research. Sure, that poor in computers gives them a tough hole, but I have still found them to be solid pack performers in most of my games where they are present.

Armours and gropo techs of course are important--which is why I almost always grab hand lasers if it is availble--it's cheap and +5 can make a difference.

Thanks for the constructive criticism of my report. I was trying to make it read a bit more than a Galactic News Network of my game, but I was rushing to get it published so I could move on to more games. I may take some of this post and take another run at the report--no promises, but I definatlely see the longer value of more "Why" to go along with the who, what, where, when, and how.

[Charis]

Bam-Bam,

Hey, thanks for taking the time to answering many of those questions!
I appreciate it. I debated even making the reply, as it did seem a case of
a presumptive title and your goal was an entertaining AAR (which it was),
but I did want to make that plug for future Imperium players (not just you) that...

... if you have a bent for writing and have a little extra time, throw the
newbies a few strategic bones by going into the why of even basic items.

Thanks again :D
Charis

[Zed-F]

I will try to keep my comments brief, but I might be able to help with some of these. I'm sure Bam-Bam will be able to fill in the rationale for his specific decisions, but I can amplify on generalities:

• Computers are one of the two most important research fields, with planetology being the other one. That's because those two fields are the only ones that have advances which will get you more raw production. Additionally, computer tech level is a significant factor in espionage chances, while planetology is important for the vote. Having Poor computers as Bulrathi is painful as a result, as they get fewer options to choose from and learn those options more slowly. The only counter is to spend more in computer research relative to the other techs.
  
• Scanners are a popular choice at the first level. There are only 3 scanner techs and nearly a dozen each of ECM and battle computers, so you are far more likely to get a better computer in your tree at some point. Also the difference between computer I and computer II is not that significant -- you need a couple levels for the effects to really start to show. ECM *is* useful, but in a limited way, as it usually only finds its way on to your missile bases. I usually want to pick up a good ECM tech at some point but it is a low priority relative to battle computer tech. Still, there are likely to be times when you've just gotten a good battle computer and don't have any options for the next level other than a slight battle computer upgrade or a significant ECM upgrade; in that case, I pick the latter.
  
• Range versus speed -- this depends on how large the gaps in space near your territory are, and on whether you want to make penetration strikes to capture specific worlds or just employ a steamroller policy when you go on the offensive. Oftentimes, you don't need more than range 5 or 6 to get everywhere you need to go, in the latter case. On the other hand, it is CRUCIAL to get speed techs better than 1 if you plan to use any kind of fleet at all -- especially if you plan to go on the offensive. Recall how often in the various AARs and tutorials that have been posted that the AI has sent a speed 1 fleet somewhere, and the player has been well-prepared for it by the time it got there? It works in the reverse as well. Moreover, also recall how any fleet has a limited shelf life before it becomes obsolete -- well the more of that time it spends in transit, the less use you will get out of it. Furthermore, if you want to take a planet, you will usually have to defend it against counter-attack until you capture it and can build up some defenses. Not only do you have to factor in fleet travel time, but you also have to factor in TRANSPORT arrival time -- and transports are slower than fleets by 1 per turn. Finally, a fast reacting fleet can potentially conver several newly conquered or still-developing colonies at once, whereas a slow one has limited value as a fast reaction force. So, Sublight and Fusion Engines really are at a magical place in the tree. Propulsion TL1-5, you have no options but range. Propulsion TL 6-10, you have range, a special, and nuclear engines, which help a bit on defense but not so much on offense as transports are still excruciatingly slow. There is a potentially valid case to make here to skip Nuclear Engines, depending on circumstances. But Sublight Engines are the first really useful engine on offense, and it arrives right at the time you might have gotten most of your initial infrastructure built, you've researched a decent missile tech and your first planetary shield... in short, you're just about able to defend your planets and are starting to think about looking to stir up some trouble. Fusion engines are even better as they allow combat speed 3, which is great for enabling bombers to get to a planet in reasonably short order. Anything faster than Fusion engines is just icing on the cake. Another factor to consider is miniaturization -- these engines occur early enough in the tree to really take advantage of miniaturization, and become quite efficient for powering beam weapons later in the game. Once you research fusion engines, you may well find that you never use anything else!
  
• Regarding spies, to send them on a mission you allocate funding and click on the mission you want to assign them to, and that's about it. If you complete a sabotage mission, you'll get a selection of options to choose from as to what kind of sabotage you want to perform (destroy factories, destroy missile bases, or promote rebellion in a colony) and if you complete an espionage mission, you will get to choose what tech to steal from a random selection of appropriate fields. I generally find espionage to be more useful than sabotage, but YMMV; I have read reports that some people like to forment lots of rebellion in empires that they intend to conquer in the near future, especially when playing as Darloks. Regarding what techs to steal, you will only get the option of what field to choose, but I find that the best strategy is to pick a field that has a tech that you are particularily interested in, and keep stealing from that field every time you get the chance until you have the tech. Note that, all other considerations aside, it is better to steal from a field which has only a few techs you are missing, than one where you are missing many, as your spies will usually steal the lowest-TL techs first, though occasionally they will luck out and get the top one. If the list of techs you are missing in that field is short, you will need fewer successful attempts to get the one you want. This is why it is better to keep stealing from the same field until it is exhausted or you've gotten what you wanted from it. What tech to steal, depends on where your own tech tree is lacking -- if you're missing robotic controls, or planetary shields, or a decent missile, you go for that. There are some subtle games you can play here -- you can use the C button to determine how many spies you have caught and how many of yor spies other empires have caught. Every turn a spy is active, it has a random result rolled for that turn, which can be a number of things: success, success and frame another race, success but captured, captured, captured and burns the rest of your spies in that empire, and so on. Oftentimes AIs will perform a "spy sweep" and spend 40% of their income in counter-espionage for a few turns, then turn it back off; you can do the same, but I find managing the ecology sliders every time I do this to be a pain, so I generally don't bother. For me, spying is a "set-and-forget" exercise, but you can play the spy game with respect to these sweeps too -- if an AI catches one of your spies, there is a good chance that this will trigger a sweep, so you can set your spies to hide for several turns to compensate. The problem is, of course, there is no way to know when to send them back on duty again, so you could easily forget to do so, or send them back while the sweep is on and get them captured anyway. As a general rule, I tend to spend about 4% of my economy on spying, unless I am playing as Darloks, in which case I may spend more. On the other hand, if I am not at war with anyone and don't wish to risk annoying the other AIs, I will spend much less. Enemy races don't like to find that you've been spying on them, especially if they catch your spy red-handed just as he's completed his mission. Races with certain attitudes (Xenophobes, Honorable, or those that didn't like you to begin with) will react more poorly to attempts at espionage and will generally declare war with only a few captured spies, while races that you are on good terms with will generally cut you some slack, especially if you are not constantly spying on them. It is, however, a good policy to plant spies in any races you are already at war with, and to keep tabs on other races (even friendly ones) with the OCCASIONAL spy. Be careful not to overdo spying on anyone you don't want to go to war with, especially if they are predisposed to view spying especially unkindly.
  
• Ship design could easily take up pages by itself. Regarding missile boats, the key factor to pay attention to is the amount of damage per missile that gets past the shields of your intended target. That's not the only factor (attack rating vs maneuver is important too) but it's usually the deciding factor. If your enemy has good shields, you need big missiles; otherwise, quantity might be more valuable than quality. Speed is important if you want to be able to move into/out of range of enemy fire expeditiously, and also adds to initiative. In addition to providing stats on enemy ships, battle scanners also provide a substantial amount of initiative and a free level of computers. Because they are such a low-level tech, they eventually miniaturize to be quite small, and thus affordable to slap on as an afterthought on designs that have spare space after the broad strokes are filled in. Regarding number of designs, don't forget that you will want to upgrade your ship designs over time. Odds are, if Bam-Bam has a number of similar designs, it's because some tech came in after he'd built some of an earlier design, and he made a new similar design to take advantage either of that new tech or the miniaturization it allowed. You generally don't want to actively design something for all six slots at once, because then if you do want to upgrade, you'll have to scrap something. I generally design 3 or less ships at any given time, so I'm not forced to scrap my existing fleet when the time comes for an upgrade. (I may choose to scrap it anyway, but it's by choice at that point.) The main thing to remember when designing a ship, is that it's not size or cost that counts, so much as ROLE. If I design a missile boat, then its main job is base-busting, so I make a ship that can take down as many bases as possible, and hang the rest -- I don't need heavy armour or shields if my goal is to hang out at long range, fire a couple salvos, and retreat before enemy return fire can reach me or when I run out of ammo. If I design a huge auto-repair ship for space superiority, its job is to be a damage sponge, so I load up on defensive equipment, and worry less about speed and weapons. If I design a small beam fighter for space superiority, its job is to be as zippy as possible (to evade enemy fire rather than absorb it) while still mounting an effective weapon+computer combo, so as to maximize both survivability and damage output in a single salvo. A lot of ship design has to do with what will work against the defenses you expect to run up against, but there is ample room left over for individual style. The best thing is to experiment and find what works for you!
  
  EDIT: So much for being brief...
  
  One more note on shipbuilding: Cost-effectiveness in ship design is a virtue in MOO. If you don't need it for the mission you're trying to fulfill, don't slap it on (but don't waste space to no good purpose either.) A BC saved in construction of one ship is a BC earned in the construction of the next ship of the same type. This doesn't mean to skimp on gear that you need to fulfill your primary mission... but if it comes down to strapping on some optional goodie that might or might not be useful, versus saving cash and just building more of them, the latter is usually the stronger option.

[Bam-Bam]

Like I said, after I pushed "post", I realized the error of my title, and tried to correct it. Was not to be. I have editied the rest of my answers to your questions into the initial response.

I debated even making the reply, as it did seem a case of
a presumptive title and your goal was an entertaining AAR (which it was)

Do NOT worry about that with me. I LOVE constructive Criticism. Thank you for taking the time to give feedback that can strengthen my writing, and thanks for reading and liking the AAR part of the report.

[Sirian]

I'm grateful to Zed for taking time to offer his analysis. He's doing a good job, and covers a number of points that I miss, bringing another perspective to the task. Plus, some things he explains cover certain areas so well, I don't need to add anything.

Let me follow up on only a couple of points where I can add something to what he said.

Scanners are a popular choice at the first level.

Of the three computer techs available initially (available if they are present in your tech tree for that game), the scanner is my LEAST favorite. I almost always choose one of the others. Here's why.

I think the Mark II battle computer is useful. Standard chance to hit is 50%. That is, if attack rating and defense rating are the same, 50% of shots will hit, 50% will miss. You start the game with Mark I available, so your missile bases in the very beginning with have attack level of 1. Enemies get +1 to defense for having maneuverability of 1. Defense is further modified by ship size. Huge ships take a -1 penalty, because they are the equivalent of "the broad side of a barn". You can't miss when shooting at something that big! At least, that is the concept behind ship classes and defense. So their default defense rating is ZERO for huge ships, but each smalerl class enjoys +1 more over the larger class. Thus the default defense rating of huge ships is 0, large is 1, medium 2, small 3. If an enemy learns Nuclear Engines, they can improve to warp two and also can improve to maneuverability class two, which adds another point to defense. When the AI's learn nuclear engines, they almost always maximize use of them, especially for any gunship or bomber designs. Missile boats, maybe not. If the enemy learns Inertial Stabilizer, they will almost always add those in that early phase when they don't know about any other special devices yet. Those add TWO points to defense and one to combat speed. The Alkari race get a racial bonus of plus THREE to defense, on top of all other modifiers. This can make them a special case, more on this in a bit.

Now... for each level of difference between attack and defense rating, there is a 10% swing in your hit rate. That is, at even-up, you hit 50% of shots. If enemy defense rating is two points better than your attack rating, you only hit 30% of shots. If enemy defense rating climbs to 5 or more points better than your attack rating, you are reduced to MINIMUM hit efficiency, where only one in twenty shots hits. That is to say, it never gets worse than 5% hit ratio for the attacker.

If the AI brings in ships with warp two engines with class two maneuvering and inertial stabilizer, they get +3 to defense. On medium ships that already have 2 defense, that moves them to DR 5. If your AR is 1 and their DR is 5, you're going to miss NINETY PERCENT of all shots. If you up your AR to 2, you would DOUBLE your hit rate (and damage) in that case, by improving hit rate from ten percent to twenty percent.

That is to say, battle computers make a major difference to actual damage rates. You can increase your attack rating on missile bases by one point with this computer upgrade. That brings AT LEAST a 20% immediate increase to missile effectiveness vs Mark I computer. Your attack rating goes from 1 to 2. Vs large enemy ships that enjoy no defense boosts, that increases hit ratio from 50% to 60%. Vs medium ships with no defense boosts, hit ratio increases from 40% to 50%. Vs medium ships with nuclear engines, hit ratio increases from 30% to 40%. Vs Alkari fighters with no shipboard defense boosts, hit rate improves from 5% to 10%, doubling damage.

Then there's the miniaturization factor Zed has mentioned. Later in the game, when building small and medium ships, especially the missile boat concept of packing one or two missile racks on a medium ship and "squeezing a computer into whatever room you have left", you often won't HAVE the room to add state of the art computers, so you must add older computers. What if you can't fit a Mark III? If you never learned the Mark II, you won't have that option. You'd then be able to add only a Mark I?

Then there's another factor. Remember that obsolete techs "add to" your total tech level in a small way. Problem is, one obsolete tech is as good as another for this purpose. When you get to, say, Battle Computer Mark VII as your state of the art, then for the purposes of "obsolete tech adds to tech level", Mark II is as good as Mark V. Obsolete tech = obsolete tech = obsolete tech, for that purpose. Thus in a sense, the earliest techs in the tree are the "best bang for buck" when you are purposely trying to gather old techs to add bits and pieces to your "current tech level", which is valuable for improving miniaturization and cost reduction in a minor way even for state of the art items.

Thus, for the first three computer techs... Here's how I rate them.

Mark II Battle Computer is the most valuable overall. There is a bona fide chance of actually USING the item itself in some types of designs even later in the game, and in the early game it can make a decisive difference in your favor if you get into actual brush wars over systems where you're building significant numbers of forces. Plus as Zed rightly points out, it is good to design ships to fit a role, and for a very few types of designs, having top computers is not a major aspect. Plus if you do get into early combat, you want every bit of computers you can get your hands on, as each level of attack rating directly improves your damage output. (Boosting computers is the next best thing to improving weapons).

ECM Jammer I is pretty much useless, but it is SO CHEAP. It is the best deal you will ever get on a miniaturization item, an "obsolete tech". And since computer tech levels are so vital to spying (the basis of spying success on both offense and defense) you can never afford to neglect computers entirely. Thus it is a bit of a no-brainer to spend pennies to learn ECM I. PLUS... if you do research ECM I, and Battle Computer Mark III is in your tech tree, you'll gain access to it. Thus one of my favorite moves is to research ECM I and then jump straight to Battle Computer Mark III. After all, if Mark II is so good, Mark III is so much better.

That is in fact what I did in the Kitten Kaboodle game. I used ECM I as a springboard. Go back and look. You will see my Computer tech level parked at "2" at one point. You only go from 1 to 2 by researching ECM I. I then leapt to Mark III.

The Deep Space Scanner tech increases scanner range from 3 parsecs to 5 parsecs, but it won't tell you ETA of rival fleets. Thus the second level of scanner tech upgrade (Improved Scanners) is the vital tech. That is the one that tells you about enemy fleet destinations and ETA. The game will then auto-warn you of incoming attacking fleets. If a fleet heads for one of your colonies, the game will start the next turn showing you. (It won't show you if you have MORE THAN ONE incoming attack, though, so you need to get into the habit of pressing F8 or F9 to start your turn, later in the game, just to review all incoming enemy fleets. Don't fall asleep at the wheel and fail to "connect the dots" when you have intelligence warning you of impending attacks!

I prefer not to spend on both the Deep Space Scanner and the Improved Scanner. The later completely replaces the former and renders it as nothing more than an "obsolete tech" toward the total tech level. Well, for an investment of 500+ BC in the early game, I'd rather not go that route, researching both. I'd rather skip the earlier Deep variety and go straight to Improved, if I can. Won't know until I see if Improved is in my tree, though, so that means I generally avoid the Deep scanner if there are other options.

Thus my favorite choice is the ECM Jammer I. That sounds kind of stupid, in one sense. It's a useless item! But it is such a cheap tech, it is worth taking the time, and it may spring me right to Mark III. My second choice is the Battle Computer Mark II, and I usually only take Deep scanner if it is the only option. HOWEVER, if Improved Scanner is not in the tree, I may rush back to get Deep scanner (or trade for it) because it's not a good thing to be playing with blinders on. Deep Scanner beats default scanner by a mile.


Now... that's some analysis about ONE set of tradeoffs and strategic thinking for ONE research field in terms of initial choice for research project. Often you don't get a choice, because only one of the three options is present in the tree. Then you just go with the flow.

The deep space scanner is itself a good choice. The scanner upgrade is very useful. You nearly double your linear scanner range, and in reality, you more than double the AREA that you can scan around a given system. That can make a difference in the expansion phase, seeing what your rivals are doing and perhaps getting more warning about threats and problems. So it's not "bad" to choose the deep scanner even if you have other options. Rather, each choice has pros and cons. (I love this game!

Computers are one of the two most important research fields, with planetology being the other one. That's because those two fields are the only ones that have advances which will get you more raw production.

I disagree with this comment.

"Raw production" is not the significant element. "Net production" is more useful. For net production, construction is just as important as planetology and computers. Waste reduction tech directly improves net production. Industrial Tech to reduce factory costs directly affects acceleration of growth AND directly affects "net production" by reducing the total cost needed to reach max factories. Each BC saved on factory construction goes directly to something else useful.

Likewise, there is no "most important research field". Shortfalls in any field are painful. The fields that are most important to one strategy or situation may not be to another. Often Force Fields are THE decisive field, because he who lacks these cannot protect what he has, regardless of other strengths. Propulsion can likewise be decisive, especially at the upper levels. Researching improved range tech is usually the first research move I make. The AI's inability to utilize speed effectively is its GREATEST weakness. And you won't do squat with anything if your weapons are not strong enough to penetrate enemy shields. You will be steamrolled.

The AI prioritizes two fields: computers and weapons. None of the AI strategies neglect these areas. Planetology is the most important field for furthering the Pop=Power dynamic, but as Zed has said, he tends to keep research balanced across all of the fields, and that is because the game balance is such that you need everything. You need it all. You can gain bits of advantage or suffer bits of disadvantage if you surge ahead or fall behind in any area.

Having Poor computers as Bulrathi is painful as a result, as they get fewer options to choose from and learn those options more slowly. The only counter is to spend more in computer research relative to the other techs.

That is not the only counter. It is usually not the best counter. Bulrathi are a pointy-stick type of race. As BamBam pointed out, planetology is important to them for the purpose of increasing growth rates to hasten replenishment of soldiers. Often the best way for Bulrathi to do "computer research" is by "researching" the alien computers found amongst the ruins of planets they've bullrushed. To that end, CONSTRUCTION tech is often the key. Armor to toughen transports that "run the gauntlet", braving enemy defenses without bothering to fight for space superiority. Millions may die in space, but if some manage to penetrate and land, well... usually that is only possible against poor worlds or very small worlds with fewer bases, and these tend to have fewer factories, too, so you won't get reams and reams of free tech from this kind of attack, but you pick up something good now and then. Bulrathi are king at playing Hot Potato, if you follow what I mean. They will be slaughtered by the missile bases of core enemy worlds, but can often rush and grab colonies that are just standing up their defenses. Grabbing worlds with a few dozen factories on them, maybe you'll learn a tech or two, maybe not. Keep at it, though, and you will eventually. Even if you don't hold the world, and it is smashed from orbit and returned to spud status, if you land and search through factories, you may learn techs. To that end, propulsion techs and armor techs are needed to do gauntlet rushing, sending unescorted transports into the teeth of lightly defended enemy worlds when their fleets are elsewhere. "While the cat's away, the mice will play." Of course, any troops you send into the teeth of a main enemy fleet will be slaughtered, so it takes skill, patience and a willingness to repeatedly throw away millions of lives on risky low-percentage moves, to prevail by this method. You may fail miserably several times for each success.

Most races in MOO do better when you play to their strengths rather than shore up their weaknesses. To play to the Bulrathi's strength is a wild ride, though. Likewise for the Alkari, Mrrshan and Darlok. These four races have strengths that tick off rivals. Thus these races are "more dangerous" to play. You either take a lot of aggressive risks, or you sit back and try to compete on equal footing with races who have economic advantages. Tough row to hoe either way.


- Sirian

[Zed-F]

Thus one of my favorite moves is to research ECM I and then jump straight to Battle Computer Mark III. After all, if Mark II is so good, Mark III is so much better.

Heh. My favourite is usually Deep Space Scanner -> Improved Robotics III -> Battle Computer IV. I find that Computer IV tends to come in right when I need to start worrying about enemy fleets. Another important note about scanners is they give your SHIPS some scanning range as well -- which means that those scouts you've got blockading systems can sometimes also give you extra warning of incoming fleets. This isn't something that will make or break your decision, though. I agree that Improved scanner is far and away more useful, but the extra range on Deep scanners has frequently given me enough warning of a slow enemy fleet that I can rush defenses to the area in time to matter. Tradeoffs, tradoffs...

Also, in your analysis, don't forget that missile bases start with a battle scanner as well -- their starting AR is 2, not 1.

"Raw production" is not the significant element. "Net production" is more useful. For net production, construction is just as important as planetology and computers. Waste reduction tech directly improves net production. Industrial Tech to reduce factory costs directly affects acceleration of growth AND directly affects "net production" by reducing the total cost needed to reach max factories. Each BC saved on factory construction goes directly to something else useful.

Yes and no. Net production is very important, but there is a point of diminishing returns on waste reduction tech that doesn't really happen with improvements to raw production. If you have 500 factories (say Meklar 100 world w/ Robotics III), Reduced waste 60%, and Enhanced Eco Restoration (1 BC/5 factories) then you will pay 60 BC on waste cleanup, or 12%. Getting Reduced Waste 40% would reduce that to 40 BC (8%), or Advanced Eco Restoration to 30BC (6%.) You're saving 20-30 BC either way. On the other hand, getting Improved Robotics IV would add +100 BC, less 12 BC in cleanup charges. Getting another +20 pop would also add +100 from factories, again less 12 BC in cleanup charges, and extra production from the population on top of that. You might argue that I'm stacking the example by picking Meklar, but the principle is the same regardless of what race you play -- only the breakpoints are different. Cleanup techs are only really valuable early, when you don't have any or don't have enough; the more you have, the less valuable new ones are. Extra raw production, on the other hand, is equally valuable all of the time.

Likewise, there is no "most important research field". Shortfalls in any field are painful. The fields that are most important to one strategy or situation may not be to another.

I would argue that while it is bad to be weak in any given field, lest you find yourself vulnerable to an attack that preys upon that weakness, there are certain fields where it pays to be stronger -- namely planetology and computers. While I don't include construction in that list, it doesn't mean that I advise neglecting construction; I just have found that it doesn't really deserve any special focus unless you are desperate for waste reduction technology and your planetology tree isn't giving you any joy in that area. The planetology waste reduction techs are generally superior to the construction ones anyway, and I do advise putting a little extra focus there. I'm not talking a lot of extra focus here -- all I'm talking about is something like, say, hitting equals to set equal spending in all fields, taking one or two clicks out of construction, force fields, propulsion, and weapons (after you have gone full bore researching your first range techs, of course,) putting them in planetology and computers, and using that as your baseline spending pattern for the rest of the game. Even picking one field at a time and putting 50% in it and spreading the rest around you can still have a similar philosophy. In that case it comes down to a matter of "pick what's needed most, but if in doubt, choose computers or planetology first."

Sometimes I will pick 3 favoured fields instead of two, and that's when I have a racial advantage for a particular category of tech that I want to promote. Alkari, for instance, get a bonus to propulsion, and get a +3 defense bonus that just screams "build an offensive fleet and USE ME!" I put a little extra focus in propulsion in this case, so as to be able to get good engines to give me a good base maneuverability rating that I can pump sky-high with my racial bonus -- a synergistic effect best promoted with a little extra propulsion research. Otherwise, I just stick with computers and planetology.

[b]Having Poor computers as Bulrathi is painful as a result, as they get fewer options to choose from and learn those options more slowly. The only counter is to spend more in computer research relative to the other techs.

That is not the only counter. It is usually not the best counter. Bulrathi are a pointy-stick type of race. [/b]

Well, ok, I stand corrected. It is, however, the only way to get AHEAD in computers, and the only way to give yourself the benefits of a tech that none of your neighbor AIs have, or have bothered to research. You'd be surprised at how often an AI will neglect robotic controls, and you can't capture it if they don't research it. I'd rather have access to what's in my tree AND what's in my neighbor's tree. Seriously, though, getting good robotic controls is important enough that I'd rather "waste" some of my RP pursuing a field I'm not inherently that strong in, as Bulrathi, to give myself a decent shot at getting ahead of the production curve and pull out of the tech hole that I start in, than rely on pointy stick research (and spying) to do it. If I rely too heavily on the pointy stick, I may find that I have fallen too far behind on the production curve to prevent myself from falling even further behind on the tech curve as well, making my pointy stick even less effective... a slippery slope indeed. Again, different approaches to the problem require different tradeoffs, and it's not a matter of either-or, but of finding a good balancing point.

[Sirian]

Heh. My favourite is usually Deep Space Scanner -> Improved Robotics III -> Battle Computer IV.

That's a good series, for a small map. I don't think it's very good for a large or especially a huge map. There's no such thing as Robotics "too soon" on a small map. There can be on a big map. Getting Robotics III early is like a setback from Industrial Tech 10 to Industrial Tech 15. Ugh. A nightmare if half your empire is still in the early growth stage. If you don't have at least Industrial 8 in place first (meaning 12BC per factory with Robotics III) this can be really painful where you need it most, trying to stand up those vulnerable colonies far from your core.

Robotics III is probably the only tech in the game that can hurt you significantly if you grab it too soon. It's the one tech you do not want to pull out of an artifacts planet in early scouting.

If you spend time on construction-planetology-propulsion to speed expansion on a large map, you will be behind in computers. Yet the tech pace goes faster while some faraway colonies are founded much later, so that's how this becomes an issue. I suppose I'm in the habit of skipping Robotics III or at least not hurrying it, but my habits are more attuned to larger maps. Clearly I can succeed on any size map, but I definitely play larger maps more often. It's always interesting to see where we disagree, though, and try to figure out whether this is merely a difference of opinion, or if there is something I'm overlooking for small map play.


- Sirian