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[SPOILERS] - social distancing with pindicator

Please advise all other players to maintain safe distance from me in game so that I may farmer gambit safely.

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Suffer Game Sicko
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https://drive.google.com/file/d/1U1Gvcm7...sp=sharing
"I know that Kilpatrick is a hell of a damned fool, but I want just that sort of man to command my cavalry on this expedition."
- William Tecumseh Sherman

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So picking third, I think the question I have to ask is if picking Traits or picking Leader is best.  RtR had put all the Traits together close enough that the answer was to pick the leader that you wanted to use - the UU & UB toys - and then pick the appropriate traits from there.  However, I'm not sure that CtH quite balances everything out enough for that to play out.  In particular, I remember RtR making this exact Financial change and then rejecting it as still being too strong in favor of Financial.  In addition, EXP takes a pretty big hit by losing the worker bonus which makes me think that FIN is the clear best trait.  I'm rather strongly considering that FIN + whatever should be my first pick.

There are still some combinations that look interesting:
  • America + PHI would let you get a LOT of great engineers and bulb a lot of wonders.  1 engineer specialist is 12 GPP/turn with a harbor!
  • Would PRO + Cothon lend enough economic bonus to justify spamming coastal cities?  Especially with circumnavigation now giving 1 extra trade route?  Actually, if you look at the bonuses given for trade routes PRO is best when you do not build a harbor.  Because you get 25% for a city being connected to a capital then PRO cities are getting 2c per trade route by default and then 3c when on a different landmass.  In addition, once you get foreign trade routes that is when you would want to get a harbor as then you're looking at 5c trade routes with PRO.  So cothon + PRO could still be a very strong idea in the midgame: potentially 20c per city with currency and circumnavigation.  Compared to 12c per city for regular civs in this time frame.  PRO/EXP seems like the natural combination for quick granaries and harbors both.  Without Cothons this is only about 3c better than non-PRO cities, which isn't quite as fantastic - but it still would be close to an additional trade route per city, or a free Great Lighthouse.  Wait, am I really talking myself into PRO here?  The breakpoints do make it look better than I first thought, I'll admit.
  • Are 70h granaries worth it even with additional culture?  Inca probably wants to be paired with EXP and then it doesn't really matter so much.
  • CRE is still probably very much worth it even with just +50% to libraries.
  • The two traits that weren't touched - SPI & IND - are still very useful.
More thoughts on civs later.
Suffer Game Sicko
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Wait, with PRO at the very start of the game you also get 2c trade routes with just a connection to your capital.

I'm really going to do this, aren't I?
Suffer Game Sicko
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Is Wang Kon *ever* not the answer? Did Byzantium get nerfed?
If only you and me and dead people know hex, then only deaf people know hex.

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Wang Kon and just get ALL the commerce? That's an idea too.

Byz had their UU strength dropped to 11 but also ignores first strikes.
Suffer Game Sicko
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Charriu you jerk! I was going to pick Mao
Suffer Game Sicko
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I think I'm stuck between 3 leaders right now:

Wang Kon (FIN/PRO) - get a tech lead with all the commerce and use that to win late.  Honestly I'm a little wary of having no production advantages early on so I think I would want something like Mali to pair with this to try and turtle more.

Charlemagne (IMP/PRO) - instead of using EXP to boost ahead we use IMP for more settlers.  This could also dovetail nicely into Carthage again as not only are you spamming more cities for trade routes but then you get double production on Stables and OG Numid spam.  RtR really makes me nostalgic for OG Numid spam.  But there are also more civs that fit in with this pairing so if Carthage isn't around on the back end then this could still work

Victoria (FIN/IMP) - Similar to Charlemagne but going more for the tried and true Financial over Protective.  And Financial is still honestly probably better in a vaccuum.  But I'm more interested in trying new things.  Vicky I've already piloted to a PBEM victory once so I'm well aware how powerful she can be.  And with the worker bonus being removed from any trait there won't be anybody faster to a second city than an IMP leader.

Writing that all out helped.  I'm definitely leaning Burger King on this one
Suffer Game Sicko
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I think there's 3 scenarios to consider for openings:
1. worker > warrior > settler at 2
2. double worker, chop out settlers
3. worker > work boat > settler at 3

Considering we're IMP/PRO my gut says that we go with #1, take advantage of the quick settler and the quick 2c trade routes, and then after getting the settler out we go worker > work boat and then chop out more settlers. But I'll need to do some sims to figure out which one seems best.
Suffer Game Sicko
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So even though I was talking about Cothons earlier, this pick is more about using IMP to leverage an early Numidian push. Rough outline of a strategy is to REX hard early with IMP and use PRO to keep the commerce coming in. Then in classical era we hit HBR early and hit a neighbor with Numids. Eat his lands, stabilize with Currency and Cothons and trade routes. Tech ahead and win the game.
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