Winter Wonderland: Selrahc's FFH 2 thread

[Selrahc]

I come bearing diplomacy!

Opening message to the vampires.

Welcome from the court of the Winter King to the Calabim Vampires

You're the last to be found by the Illian empire and our far ranging scouts. If you need any help finding and setting up contact with the other nations of the world the Illians would be happy to assist. I've not heard much about your empire from the other denizens of the world, although a river of blood that washed through a while back told us of your presence.

Regards
Selrahc

Got in a chat with Bob later. First few messages came to my smartphone, before I swapped to the laptop so I'm missing the start of the correspondence.

bobchillingworth: probably not too much to really say at the moment
your scouting is pretty impressive apparently
mine got eaten
me: More lucky than anything
You're actually pretty close to a few people
bobchillingworth: huh
me: If you need directions or anything
bobchillingworth: sure, I'd appreciate that
me: Archduke is pretty much right on your doorstep to the west
Sareln is to your north
bobchillingworth: hmm I've scouting a little ways that direction, haven't seen him
me: A little further away
bobchillingworth: toward archduke that is
me: I remember it being pretty damn close? Maybe 6 tile between your current borders
bobchillingworth: what?
that can't be right...
unless he has two cities
me: After two border pops
I might be wrong on the exact thing.
Tile distance
Um, he is a little north
bobchillingworth: send me a screen cap and I'll count em' for you
me: We'renot allowed to until map making
bobchillingworth: what
me: Cartography
Agreement in tech thread?
bobchillingworth: oh I guess
I don't pay attention to that stuff
evidently
me: It wasn't really a firm thing.
bobchillingworth: well whatever I'm sure someone will have the tech soon enough
me: Yeah. Fairly cheap.
Fairly useful
bobchillingworth: found any great lairs or whatever they're called?
me: Nothing epic.
bobchillingworth: unqiue features
there we go
me: Found Letum but Sareln had already taken the bonus out of commission
bobchillingworth: other civs can do that?!
I always thought that it spits out a different flavor text each time
for every civ
me: Yep. But the AI can't, so you're guaranteed it in single player
bobchillingworth: interesting!
my land seems pretty sweet, but I'm really getting hammered by barbs
5 barrows and 2 ruins constantly stream stuff at me
me: I've not had too many problems so far.
bobchillingworth: I also haven't found any features and only one mana node, but I'm not going to scout much until BW
me: I've got a shock promoted bloodpet down there, I was thinking of taking down a barrow
bobchillingworth: don't be alarmed if you see some barbarian moroi running around
wait are you actually exploring these thigns
me: Not really. Not yet
bobchillingworth: I've had a few opportunities, but always way too close to home if I popped a heroic barb assassin or something
me: Taking out barrows is generally a lot more worth it than the other stuff.
Pretty favourable results table too
bobchillingworth: hmm
Sent at 10:12 PM on Tuesday
me: Anyway, PB is off in the far west, Cull is in the Northeast.
Cull is probably easier to find. Sounds like hes close to Sareln.
And that basically puts you up to date on the general map situation
bobchillingworth: except where you are

me: Oh right, I'm between PB and Sareln. Up in the north
Southlands look split between you and Athlete.
bobchillingworth: k. sounds like maybe I have a lot of free space to my east
me: Uh, I meant archduke
Sorry
bobchillingworth: no one to my direct east or south east, right?
me: Not to my knowledge. I only know Cull's capital location second hand though
But you should be fine to expand that way.
Sent at 10:16 PM on Tuesday
me: I'm probably giving way too much away here, but I just don't see much point in hoarding information at this point
We're all going to find it out eventually. Might as well be sooner
Sent at 10:18 PM on Tuesday
bobchillingworth: well I appreciate it
me: No worries
Don't think we've got much else to sort out. Talk to you later.

Yeah, not much need to cunningly pump me for map information. I basically just offer it up on a silver platter. Looks like he really hasn't got any foreign contacts at all before this point.

I really don't think it'll make much difference in the long run though. And hopefully a good first impression will be useful.


Also sent a few messages out to the other leaders.

Greetings PB
Well I've found the last of the tribes of this land. A pale breed, averse to sunlight. At first we thought it was more Svartalfar but after checking their ears it turned out to be vampires instead. They're located to the southeast of Archduke and south southeast of Sareln. That rounds up the full set.

North Wind the scout has done his initial recon and is currently heading on a broad arc towards the west. His starting position is near the nothern area of Hippus land, and is arcing around the previous explorations in that area.

If you're available it would be good to get a chat going in the next few days, I've got some issues to discuss that might work a little easier in a faster format.

Regards
Selrahc

Greeting and Salutations Winter King,

It is with deepest regrets that I must inform you that his Lordship Pb is currently unavailable for any indepth communications.
His favourite centaur recently died and he is in a period of deep mourning.

The Kuriotate Empire is presently being stewarded by myself and a capable outsider.
I will inform his Lordship of your wishes as soon as he returns.

Humble Regards,
M. Keown, Hand to the Kuriotates.

Pocketbeetle looks to be out of diplo for a while due to RL something or other, with a sub coming in. I was planning on getting his views on the PoW plans, but it can wait.

One of the reasons I wanted to bring him in was that I promised to let him know when I felt Kyan could come in, and once I tell him about the PoW plan there isn't much that Kyan could reveal. The lack of a dedicated lurker probably makes finding a sub a little harder.


Also sent a message to the Hippus in an attempt to build relations.

Just an update on the exploration, we have found the Calabim a stones throw from your capital. If you haven't found them yet head east and you should stumble on them in short order.

Not got a message back. :/


And lastly I sent a message to Sareln. No message sent to Cull because he probably doesn't have anyone nearby. Maybe I should send one anyway.

A quick update on exploration, we have found the vampires in the southlands, almost directly to the south of your capital. Thought you might want to know.

Thank you, how far south? It's a difficult run to make with all the
jungle/lizards around.

Probably 8 to 10 tiles between your borders? I approached from the south, so I haven't seen his northern border or your southern border which makes it pretty difficult to judge exact distances. He looks a few tiles east compared to your position so maybe a little more.

Alright, thanks once again, I'll try and run a scout to him, though
Pocketbeetle's scout just went running past my southern border with 2
lizard-men in tow...

-Sareln-

This is what I'd have sent anyway. But hopefully I can get him thinking about exploration and sending scouts out to meet foreign leaders. I'd much rather that than having them sitting in the cities defending from Priests of Winter.

[Selrahc]

Free tech from the hut.


AKA: Alchotech

Crafting is honestly kind of a filler tech, kind of like ancient chants. It acts as a speedbump before you get to more useful techs like mining.

Crafting lets you build wineries with workers. It also lets you build the deruptus brewing house. This is a national wonder only buildable next to a river. It gives access to Ale, a luxury resource. The first impulse after learning to craft is to get pissed apparently.

The deruptus brewing house also means vegetable resources add to commerce generation in the city that built it. Since in FFH there is no city limit on National Wonders it's probably a good idea to build it in a commerce centre. With the right resources it can add 30% to the city commerce rate.

Anyway, aside from the implications to the Illian's livers this will be a big help in getting mining nice and quickly. Saves me a good few turns of research. I can go right from agriculture to mining.


Unfortunately that may be the last we hear from north wind the scout. The plucky little fellow is probably going to be eaten by goblins next turn.

[Maksim]

Hi!

I'm hoping to do some analysis of the players' positions in this game, and to do so, it would be nice to have some comparable figures. Turn 50 (a nice round figure) is up and coming soon, so could you upload a few screenshots (city view and overall), and describe your situation at the end of it, please?

1) What are you building in your city\cities? What tiles are you working?
2) What is your current research and hammer potential?
3) Do you feel you have been affected much by Stasis? By River of Blood?
4) What techs have you researched so far?

Thanks a lot!

P.S. I'm posting this in every player's thread, by the way.

[darrelljs]

Nice pop . Too bad you don't have any grapes lying around but getting to Mining quicker will be a big deal.

Darrell

[Selrahc]

I've taken about a billion pictures this turn, so before I start with that lets do a simple Q&A with Maksim's questions. More detailed answers are evident from the pictures and their comments in most cases.

1) What are you building in your city\cities? What tiles are you working?
My capital Silent Night is working on the White Hand Ritual. In two turns it gets a population point after which it will be less than twenty turns until it is completed. My estimate on finishing the ritual has been revised downwards to T70. There is a reason for this.

My second city has just finished an elder council and is working on warriors warriors warriors. Hopefully I'll be able to get 4 or 5 of them finished by the end of construction on the White Hand. This may be very necessary.

2) What is your current research and hammer potential?

At the moment I'm a lot better with hammers than with research. My research potential is basically all from elder councils right now with very few commerce tiles in radius of my cities.

When the forest is removed my capital looks to have decent potential as a commerce city, with lots of potential for riverside cottages. My second city is probably going to be hammer focussed for the foreseeable future.

3) Do you feel you have been affected much by Stasis? By River of Blood?

Stasis obviously affected me hugely. It's my edge and it is one I'll have to try and maintain. Without stasis my current strategy would be doomed to failure.

River of Blood less so. It's put me slightly behind schedule, but it didn't prevent me from getting my second city out and the large food potential at the capital meant it regrew fast. Minor impact in all.

4) What techs have you researched so far?
Crafting, Exploration, Ancient Chants, Mysticism and Philosophy. Currently researching Agriculture (7t)

Without further ado then, let's skip to the turn report.



Here we have the technology that this entire strategy has been building towards: Philosophy.

Normally a so-so tech that leads to later and better technologies this is the Alpha(if not the Omega) of the Illian game. I've highlighted the White Hand ritual there. The Priests of Winter are coming, and they're coming soon.

[SIZE="3"]City shots.[/SIZE]



Now you might note I'm not working a scientist. Looking at the current demographics it became clear that I couldn't afford to footer about with running a scientist. I need max production and I need it now. With that in mind then I'm running two turns at the current level of food to increase population to 6, then swapping over to maximum hammers. Total time taken to build the priests should be just 19 turns.

In that time Jingle Bells should be able to build 5 warriors if my estimates are right. Possibly 6 by the time the priests have walked over to rendezvous with their bodyguards. I've got two spare warriors from city defence at the moment, taking them as well and my army becomes 3 PoW's and 8 warriors. That will have to be enough.

The names of the cities have been changed. My previous naming scheme was a kind of vague scheme. I was planning on adding various other wintry locales to the list, but it was basically kind of boring. So I've switched it to Christmas songs. Not very seasonal, but a lot easier to maintain.

I wanted to name the capital Winter Wonderland but sadly that is too many characters.


[SIZE="3"]Graphs and Demographics[/SIZE]
Let's have a look at the graphs next. These are pretty interesting, and I'll be the only one able to show you a full picture. No espionage in FFH so the game lets you look at others graphs without the rigmarole of passive spying. I'll start with the culture graph, which is pretty straightforward.



The Illians are the only ones with a monument, and the only ones who didn't sit out 14 turns. Everyone else is on roughly the same level, give or take a turn of anarchy.



Score tells a pretty similar story. The seemingly neverending research on philosophy and the lag between settling and land score increase let the other nations catch up momentarily, but the Illians are definitely highest in score. For the little that is worth. I'm not sure what's happening to Cull and Archduke. Nearest I can figure they're working on a relatively expensive technology and waiting for it come in. I imagine Cull is going for mining, but I'm not sure about Archduke.



Next up is the food chart. I'm on roughly the same pop as everyone else so this is pretty even. I was a little ahead recently due to working max food over two cities, but for some reason PB has pulled ahead. I'll have to investigate that.

He's expansive, so there is a possibility that he has built his second city already, despite the stasis. Of course there is also the possibility that with his 3 tiles radius he simply has a large number of food resources to work. He is also size 6.

The other thing to note is that Sareln's food numbers recently took a dive. I don't think he is working on a settler or worker.



GNP is wonderfully complicated looking now that I've met everybody. I'm pretty sure PB is the only one with good commerce tiles in his BFC (Or really big fat splodge for the Kuriotates). As expected from the early game, nobody is pushing it too much yet. Archduke's is incredibly low! Which is probably why his score hasn't increased much really.



Power is pretty even as everybody builds barb defence and exploration units. I'm sitting on top alongside Sareln(eek) and Bob. Nobody has been able to ignore it much though.

PB's decent standing here means he is less likely to have built a settler.




The really alarming screenshot however is here. Look at Sareln's production! I think he may be on to me, and is starting to build defence units. This could be more difficult than I thought.

Regardless, I can't stop now. Not least because if I take my military away to go kill Archduke or someone then Sareln could very well sucker punch me with his troops. The only solution is to meet it head on. I'm hoping this is just a scare though, and he is planning on building something else. Not too likely though...

This is why I'm not running a scientist. If Sareln is running a defence I can't give him any free turns, even if it hurts me in the long run, his survival would hurt me more.



The top five cities screen puts me in at a pedestrian third. Pfft. Most cultured city in the world by a country mile and I'm overlooked just because there are a few thousand less people? Piffle.

Kwythellar is fine at size 6 because sprawling gives an inherent +3 happiness to every city. Prespur on the other hand should be unhappy right now unless Bob has gotten a happiness resource connected.



And so we come to the demographics shot. Which tells the same story again, but in a vaguer fashion.

Nobody has an approval rate of less than 50%, so Bob hasn't grown himself unhappy. The options then are that he has completed a worker, researched to calendar and built on a happiness resource or... he has settled near one of the games unique features.

Remnants of Patria, Mirror of Heaven, Tomb of Sucellus, Seven Pines, Yggdrassil, Standing Stones or Dragon Bones all add to happiness in nearby cities. Yggdrassil provides a happiness resource that applies to health and happiness in all cities.

Bob moved his settler, it is entirely plausible that he is near any of these locations. I'm doubting Yggdrassil, Dragon Bones or Remnants though. The graphs don't show those being worked.

[SIZE="3"]
Scouting efforts[/SIZE]



There is Northwind the scout on the western marches. His mission is to uncover detail on the western area, with an emphasis on the Kuriotates whose home I still haven't found. He managed to escape the goblins, who didn't attack. Will he be eaten by a tiger? Find out soon!



Here is Flothers the Bloodpet. I've not said much about him, but he deserves a mention. The oldest living unit in my empire he has been sent on suicide mission after suicide mission but still survives. He has single handedly contacted the Svartalfar, Calabim, Khazad and Hippus. He's personally defeated bears, lions and orcs in single combat. He was the first Illian unit to enter the legendary Letum Frigus. The first to contact a barbarian. The first to see the coast. Without him the extent of Illian exploration would be less than half.

One day soon I'll get him killed.

For now though he is investigating the Southlands. A benighted region full of vampires and lizardmen. One of the lizards is creeping up on him right now but I have no doubt he'll dispatch it as ruthlessly as he has his other foes.

Here are the great maps



This is the core of the empire, or the Frozen North as I know it. Not too great, but certainly nothing to complain about. Perhaps a little too much desert for comfort. We'll have to attend to that...

If I don't claim all the land in this screenshot then something has gone dreadfully wrong.



This is the northland of the western marches. Some lovely resources, but sadly it is likely to be claimed by the Kuriotates in time.



I think of this place as the border reaches. Land I am likely to be able to make a claim on but one that will be contested by Archduke and possibly Bob and PB too.



And below that lies the benighted southlands. I imagine this area will be split between Archduke and Bob.


And that wraps up my T50 spectacular. I hope it was informative. It's all downhill from here guys.


Stay frosty

[Maksim]

And that wraps up my T50 spectacular. I hope it was informative. It's all downhill from here guys.

It certainly was, thank you!

[Ilios]

Thanks for the update Charles!

No Workers for you just yet I guess...

[darrelljs]

Fab update !

I've switched it to Christmas songs.

The thought of Auric in a santa hat singing "O Tannenbaum" is going to be hard to get out of my head now, thanks for that !

Darrell

[Selrahc]

The thought of Auric in a santa hat singing "O Tannenbaum" is going to be hard to get out of my head now, thanks for that !

Depressing as it is Auric is probably the closest thing in Erebus to Santa.

No Workers for you just yet I guess...

Ideally I'd love to be making one in my second city right now, to complete at around the time agriculture finished. Can't really afford that. Making all kinds of economic sacrifices to get this priest rush ready.


Or maybe I could afford to do some waiting? Diplo message from PB puts Sareln's production graph into perspective.

Hi Selrahc,

Realised I never thanked you for informing me about the Vampires turning up, so thankyou.

As general gossip I can tell you that the Kuriotates and Svartalfar have entered a short meaningless war.
Vanilla Ice was cornered by a couple of barbs and had to take a shortcut through Svart lands.
Sareln has agreed we'll re-sign peace as soon as possible.

The situation around his capital is pretty hot right now.
I would guess that Sareln currently has around 3 lizardmen and 2+ skeletons wandering around either inside or just outside his cultural borders.
Expect him to lose a couple of warriors over the next few turns.

Regards,
Pb, Fishwife Boy-King.

Sareln is getting pounded by the barbs. I've been getting off quite lightly in that area, probably because of all my neighbours. But if he is in need of immediate barb defence there really isn't much option but to go hammer mad.

I'm hoping that the barbs end up killing some of his units, and that he goes back to peaceful production without a built up defence. Barb defence can easily double as rush defence...

[Selrahc]

Yowza! I said I wouldn't delay the priests for anything and the game determined to prove me a liar. The big O himself has spawned outside my borders and it's all hands to the pumps.


We meet again mister spike hat

Orthus is an unholy terror that spawns in to destroy your civilization in it's infancy. If you're unprepared or he comes with a large bodyguard he'll be feasting in the ruins of your capital before too long. If he attacks alone without promotions he'll leave nothing behind but his fancy axe. I'd hoped he would attack an opponent, but this isn't too bad.

If you look at his promotions you can see that he is a hero. I think I've mentioned before that the hero promotion gives free xp until 100 has been reached. Orthus spawning a long way from civilization is thus normally more powerful than if he pops up right on your borders, as he will have had time to promote into a serious threat.

In my capital right now I have a shock warrior and an unpromoted warrior. That isn't enough if Orthus gets a little lucky. I'm going to add two more warriors in before he gets to the capital. Orthus is an uncomplicated beast, he'll run screaming to my city and attack my forces. Hopefully it will all be fine in just a few turns.

I'm not worried about this. My top defender is promoted with combat 1 and shock. Orthus will be attacking across a river. I should have good odds to kill him right away.


There are seriously no good images of a flaming axe on google

The upside of the attack by Orthus is the capture of his axe. This is a piece of equipment and it can be passed around between units. It gives +1 fire strength and the ability to attack multiple times per turn.

This is actually really useful to my attack. It means that I can give it to each Ice Elemental(Silly as the image of an ice elemental with a flame weapon is) to up their attack by a point.


I'm pretty sure Orthus should be fairly easy to deal with then. However if he'd come with a retinue...


Like say a half dozen lizards and skeletons. Well then there would have been a bit of agitation.

Remember when I said FFH games ramped the barbs up considerably? Well we still haven't seen the worst of it yet. When the barb cities start spawning they will start sending out kill teams. When some of the players start exploring lairs we'll unleash powerful monsters. If the armageddon count goes up the horsemen will ride for the barbarians. And this is without Acheron spawning and bringing his accursed followers.

Never underestimate the barbarians in Fall From Heaven.