Looks like we have a good dogpile in our hands, will be interesting to see if we can pull this of. We have decided to give 4 former DZ cities to Gav and trust in our navy to contain him and BGN while we keep beating Comm. We also try to hit some lightly defended islands of Gav.
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[SPOILERS] Rusten and Hitru laugh off any and all mistakes as bad RNG
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To give a short update the dogpile has been averted.
BGN just took back a city on his continent and offered peace. No problem with that. It was not an original war target, we just took it because it was empty way back when. Gavagai took the cities on his starting continent and offered peace for now. Fine with that. I was hoping he would offer peace after taking those DZ cities which is why we didn't make a big attempt at saving them. Commodore is the only threat to win so we're beating him down. More importantly we've completed military science which means that we have SotL to control the seas and perhaps more importantly G3 grenadiers baby! Best unit in the game until infantry more or less. 50% withdrawal in addition to having higher base strength than all counterparts right now. Even rifles won't stand a chance so when steel is done we have all the techs we need (2nd GA is available which should be enough for the tech).
What do you think about the decision to settle those DZ cities in the first place? The yields/military buffer was worth it?
Been wondering about that myself.
It's hard to say. It cost us almost nothing to capture/settle them and the maintenance was really low as it was near our Forbidden Palace, but of course we knew that Gav wanted the whole thing for himself. We've drafted a bunch there and it's been a plus for the economy, but if it was worth the hit in relations to Gav is uncertain. I was right about Gavagai not making a move until he had chemistry of his own, but it came at an unfortunate timing. If I had known that Commodore would be so all in on an early attack then I wouldn't have settled them I think, but Commodore had so much land that we expected him to consolidate and tech Military Science/Steel instead of going for a hail Mary galleon play towards our core. Maybe we overestimated his position, but in our minds there was no need for such a risky/reckless move. I'm very curious to read ComPin's thread and see their thoughts about this. They could've rolled over Cairo or someone else instead, who've had 0 power the entire game and are lucky to be alive. They could've gone for the BGN shrine too. They had more production than us at the time. I said somewhere earlier that I thought it would be a mistake to attack Commodore head on with frigates and preferred to force a concession by killing everyone else. They went the other route though. If Commodore had not gone for that aggressive play we could've used those 45 drafted muskets plus other units to nullify/eliminate Gavagai instead, but we were spread really thin as it played out so we gave up on the cities. A move being good or bad depends on other rivals plans and sometimes it's hard to guess where they go. In our opinion it was a mistake by Commodore to gung-ho attack, but maybe we would've pulled ahead anyway -- police state and representation were pretty big.
Basically I thought it was a MAD situation where we'd both be better off targeting other people. There was a big window where only us+Commodore had frigates, but we spent the entire time locked in a stalemate because he made the galleon play. I'm still wondering if the move was made out of desperation thinking we'd eventually grow far ahead or because he thought he was much stronger at the time. I really don't know what was going through his mind, so it will be an interesting read.
Honestly looking at it now, those DZland cities were key. There's nothing like having a few worthless cities to allow an emotionally cathartic war to no effect. Sucked in a few muskets from us, and the Gavagai eating them->feels better->emotionally satisfied sequence was decisive.
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As always, fun reading an opponent's thread and realizing I had no clue what the other guy was thinking.
(December 27th, 2018, 13:02)Rusten Wrote: Naufragar did indeed want gpt in exchange for OB. He sent an offer with us giving 3gpt on top. I rejected it at first, but we sent it back this turn as currency is finished. Incredible deal for him, but at least it's a positive and it keeps him on our side until astronomy (we hope). I promise I had no idea how lopsided this was. Trade is not one of my strong suits... Oh, and don't listen to Mack. I'm not a martyr.  Good game!
There is no way to peace. Peace is the way.
(April 5th, 2019, 16:16)Rusten Wrote: Basically I thought it was a MAD situation where we'd both be better off targeting other people. There was a big window where only us+Commodore had frigates, but we spent the entire time locked in a stalemate because he made the galleon play. I'm still wondering if the move was made out of desperation thinking we'd eventually grow far ahead or because he thought he was much stronger at the time. I really don't know what was going through his mind, so it will be an interesting read. At the time we were looking for a knockout blow, and we also knew your economy was far better than ours. (Pyramids was just amazing for you guys!) We knew it was down to the two of us and that we had an opportunity to go for your capital while you were not aware of a threat. Unfortunately we didn't think about you having sight on naufrager's cities until the ships were halfway through his lands. I think Commodore even identified a route after the fact that would have let us still move through undetected by city vision, but by then it was too late.
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