Aye, it appears that I've forgotten Chancel of Guardians, sadly
I, personally, think it is a wonderful idea ... if not 100% theme appropriate, EitB is much more about the Mechanics and Balance of the game than is about them, and its not too large of a discrepancy for me to really lose any sleep over it.
IMHO, Chancel is a building *very* unlikely to be built (at least in, say, all cities), and as such it is (IMHO) the perfect Candidate for march. It's application of the Defensive promotion is via Python ... ergo, it can do both with ONLY XML CHANGES!!
I really REALLY like this idea. Thanks for suggesting it. ^_^
First, I retract all comments about Manticores/ Minotaurs needing to be 'limited.' Having them spawnable + buildable is plenty fine.
Second, after playing around with Late-game spawns ... Manticores are completely perfect. Nothing wrong with em ... BUT!!! Minotaurs are a bit of a wasted opportunity imho. I mean, I understand, to an extent, where the unit-type is coming from, but I think that making them *weaker* than Succubi is, perhaps, a mistake.
What do I mean? Well, they can't use metal. So an Iron succubus is 8 str + spells, while a Minotaur is always 8/11. And then a mithril succubis is 10 str. Succubi are perfect, they are Champion UUs in essence.
Minotaurs, imho, would be better served at being 6/11 + metals, or, perhaps, 8/13 (or 6/13) without metals. Idk.
-----------------> on the OTHER hand, its quite possible that Minotaurs are PERFECT. What do I mean by this? Each level of strength adds a LOT to win odds ... so that 11 defense is actually quite meaningful. And at 13 strength (or 15 w/ metals) might be too strong for something spammable.
So ... my suggestion is as follows.
Final Suggestion
6/11 + iWeaponTier 2 ( 8/13 str )
*or*
6/11 + Earth II (for stoneskin effects). To give em something a lil extra.
Now, I'm not certain that this is 100% necessary, it just seemed a bit fair, due to the price of the tech that they come at. However, this is a 'light' suggestion. Only meant for if you felt it was competitively necessary.
Because ... 8 str Succubi + 3 defensive strength might actually come in handy (I mean, I love it in SP) ... but does it need anything extra for MP?
tldr; I really like Minotaurs. They *probably* shouldn't be any stronger as they currently are .... ( MAYBE shift to 7/12 str )
My ultimate suggestion is rly just to NOT limit their numbers, I guess. Taking away metals from them (assuming that they ever could have used metals) was probably the right blanacing move. At 8/11 they are a deceptively useful for guarding stacks. And, at their place in the tech tree, they are meant for guarding mage stacks. Of course, in most ways Succubi are better. So the question is ... WHY are succubi the 2nd best Gate spawn? (behind Mobius Witch).
Still, Minotaurs, if we made them any stronger (to make it 'more fair' in comparison to succubi) might just make em too strong. So its possible that they are at perfect equilibrium.
(of course, *Manticores* are either 3rd best, in terms of position, or are *BEST* in terms of pure usefulness.)
Revelers are ok (4th best), and Minotaurs are in a kind of *sweet spot* at 5th place, where any stronger and they automatically become 1st place.
Then you have shit-tier spawns .... with Tar Demons being nice defenders b/c of amoeba splits, but suck in movement, and then Chaos Mauraders are just like weaker, non amoeba split Tar Demons with barely more movement to really matter. (1 move, can't haste, can't gain xp outside of combat). Still, 3 movement w/ Engi is better than the flat 1 movement of the Tar demon. I'd almost go so far to AVOID using Carnivals as Sheaim
alright. So after using them a bit more, a more refined analysis.
Manticore. Flying, 4 move, cannibalism, 13 attack/ 9 defense. Req. Commune with Nature
Minotaur. 1 move, 8 attack, 11 defense. Req. Pass through the Ether.
Now, due to the out-of-the-way tech for Manticores, it *does* technically merit being the *best unit* in the spawn tree, from a unit stats analysis only ...
BUT ... its req. building is almost worthless for (at least an RP) Sheaim player ... while Minotaurs is on magic path and its building is very very useful.
Therefore Either keep Minotaur as is, or possibly make it 7/12 instead. Making it 7/12 would make it more unique. As succubus is max 10/10 with mithril, and 12 str might possibly be the *highest* a spawn can go if it *isnt* the Manticore. (with unique Commune w/Nature/ Grove requirements)
Ultimately, spawn rate isn't fast enough for a 'Manticore' rush to ever see the light of day, but as stack defenders, Succubi and Minotaurs are almost always worth while.
Now, if Chaos Maurader was made better, and possibly moved to Alchemy Lab... ?
But ey, maybe its not so bad to have a shit-tier spawn at the bottom, eh? (not that 'Maurader rush' would EVER possibly be a thing however ...) So, from a multiplayer perspective ... it might be worthwhile looking for a Maurader solution.
Well, a change from 8/11 to 7/12 wouldn't be a straight increase in power, imho. At 8/11 I'll try to attack with Minotaurs too sometimes, if I have decent odds.
I won't deny that mutation is good, but its not a guarantee. And haste pretty much just makes sure it can keep up with Succubi (who have a base move of 2)
