[spoilers] AT makes a funny thread title

[AutomatedTeller]

Question: why don't I have visibility on Ruff's capital?   It's on a hill.  I own the tile in the red square. If that was land, I believe I would see the cap.    Is it because it's a water tile?

Yes.  Water tiles are "lower" than land tiles, which makes it easier to see over them and harder for them to see over land.

My question is:  is there any general etiquette about doing this or not doing this?    I'm quite a ways from chariots rolling off the lines, as it were, so this might just be moot.    But can anyone see anything inherently wrong in my doing this?

No, there is nothing inherently wrong about declaring war on one civ in order to be able to attack units belonging to another civ.  Of course, you'll have to observe a three-way turnsplit if you do so.  (That is:  Obviously diplomatic ramifications are unknown to me, but it certainly wouldn't be "cheating.")

Didn't think about the turnsplit.  Well, that's not worth the pain, just to pick off some axes.  I'll let it be and just continue expansion

[AutomatedTeller]

Turn 52, where the secrets of the great northern island are revealed!!!





Well, THAT was anti-climactic.    Does give me choices - useless tundra tile, useless ice tile, actually improvable ice hill tile which might be better used for defense. 

There's a fair chance that the best I can do is settle and run as a plain specialist.   I am guessing there is another sea food up there - mr cairos has fur and Ruff;s has clam.  

In other news, not much.   Whipped the axe in DeliciousDish, changing my mind about that.    Pumping up mil is good.  Don't mind being last, but don't want to be TOO last, you know?

Brought my medic 1 scout home - the other guy is moving south to bounce along superdeath's border, assuming that is safer from barbs than running through the middle of the continent.

SD continues to pour all his espionage into me.  He continues to have not met GKC, as well.\

Settle AllThingsConsidered next turn.  Still planning on settling the desert.

Did I mention my stupid thought of building stonehenge in WaitWait when I miss Oracle?     I'm thinking of pumping 2 GP our of it, one with one priest from a temple, the 2nd with 4 priests from temple/shrine.  that would 50 turns, total.  With oracle or stonehenge, I'd save 15 turns, which might be key for getting a theology bulb first, and getting a head start on AP.

One thing I noticed is that Ruff's capitol isn't on freshwater, which kind of sucks for him. also, he's not hooked up to the river that dumps onto the coast, so if I get sailing, we can't trade anyway.

2 turns for priesthood, 1 turn of gold, then 3 for masonry after that.  AllThings will jump costs up quite a bit.

OnPoint overflowed a couple of hammers, which means I'll be able to whip in 2 turns, not 3.

CarTalk took the clam.

Gold should be roaded next turn, then PeterSagal improves the cow.

[AutomatedTeller]

So, I've been thinking about how I win this.

I don't get many discounts, but I do get a lot of cities (check!), cheap granaries (check!) & temples. And with only one IND civ, I don't have any particular disadvantage with wonders. With extra cities, I should be able to build more than my share of wonders.

And, of course, units and war, to generate great generals.

[AutomatedTeller]

Turn 53, where expenses go up a lot

Founded AllThings - AllThingsConsidered is too long



Corn finishes in a couple of turns and it should grow to size 2 in like 5 turns, then I can whip the terrace a few turns after that.  It's not hooked up - it will when I get sailing, in about 10 turns or so.   



Expenses went way up - my 10% saves me a gpt in maintenance.   Big thing is the rise in civic costs.  At this point, if I drop slavery, I can save 1 gpt.   I'll keep that in mind, but I'm definitely whipping next turn. 

Further exploration up north continues to disappoint: 



Right now, I'm wondering if I should try to settle purple before the island.  Still want it, but it currently seems like total crap.  an ice hill being the best tile in the first ring is not my idea of a nice city, even if it is worth 8 cpt (+1 for each existing city and +3 for it)



DeliciousDish is building a worker to catch the overflow.  I'll switch it to either a workboat or an axe next turn for it to grow on.  I'll whip the worker in at size 3. 

Anyone know what the c next to OnPoint and AllThings means? Working unimproved tiles, maybe?

Demos still aren't changing much:



Superdeath really doesn't want me to get his graphs. Or he's forgotten that all his espionage is on me.  

It's not shown, but the gold is connected

[AutomatedTeller]

And I think to myself, what a wonders-ful world

What do I want for wonders?

Below is a list of the early game wonders I'm looking at.  I roughly picked pre-middle ages to define early game.  I included the theology wonders, because I think the AP is a priority, but not Music, Philo or Civil Service (not that CS has a wonder attached to it)

Top priorities:

Great Lighthouse - This will be worth 10-24 cpt, without capturing any other cities.  Longer the game goes, the more valuable this is - I think about 1500-2000 commerce, over all.
Pyramids - very big for a spiritual civ, as those civics are not available for a long time.
Apostolic Palace - payback on this for a large spiritual civ is pretty fast.

These are wonders that I think anyone would say I want.  

Next:

Oracle - free tech is always good.  Priest points help in getting GP for shrine, theo bulb.  Fail gold is a fine fall back.  
Collosus - I'll be working a lot of water tiles anyway.  This is probably not as much as the lighthouse, but I have 2 lakes and 6 seafood that I expect to work, plus I do expect to build Moai, plus I'll have several fishing villages that will work water tiles.

These two are tied together - I doubt I can get collosus without oracle.  I'm still assuming Mr Cairo builds oracle to get his forges.  Or maybe GKC, so he can super power fin coast.

Next:

Statue of Zeus - the XP would help
Hanging Gardens - nice bonus to a big civ
Shwedegon Paya - this would get me access to free religion, which is useful, but I think i'll be heading up the religious tech tree, anyway.  
Angkor wat - temple + mercantilism + angkor wat is 2 hammer/1 gold, which isn't bad at all.
Great Library - always good
Hagia Sophia - engineer points are nice and faster workers is a subtle help - you shave a turn off an improvement, by and large.  

All of these are useful, but none are game breaking.

Low Priority

Great wall - makes GP generation in my territory awesome.  that said, it's probably the most useless wonder for this game.  GSpys are really only good for GA.
Stonehenge - only for the GP points, really
Temple of Artemis - expensive and limited value
Chichen Itza - adds defense to recently captured cities. I don't think it's the worst wonder
Parthenon - I mean, it's fine, but I don't see it being worth it
Mauseleum of Mausollos - fine wonder, but golden ages are less important to a spiritual civ.

These are between marginal and not useful

[AutomatedTeller]

Turns out the C means that citizens are automated. I guess I haven't set anything in WaitWait manually yet?

I may switch out of slavery after I whip the terrace in OnPoint. Saving 5 gold isn't much, but if I do that 3 times, I save enough for a turn of research. I doubt anyone is paying very close attention to who is in slavery and who isn't.

[AutomatedTeller]

Huh. My next 2 cities really up the costs. Gold, the southern city, bump costs to 19 gpt, mainly in city costs. Adding the island city after that jumps costs to 28 gpt.

With sailing and a few more cottages, I'll be able to run about 50% and still have a reasonable tech rate.

[AutomatedTeller]

Turn 54, where are you??

No, I won't explain it.  No, I never saw it.

I've decided not to flip out of slavery to save money, at least not for awhile - I'll want to whip a worker in DeliciousDish in a few turns and then a terrace in AllThings. And probably an axe in WaitWait once I have masonry and can get the marble bonus.

I tried to figure out how many people had priesthood by analyzing how long it would take at various increments.  Then I remembered that known tech doesn't do anything in the ancient age.

My score is going nuts.  Guess that's what happens when you have a lot of cities.  

Got priesthood - saving gold for a turn for a 2 turn run at Masonry, coming in on turn 58.

With an axe whip and 2 chops, I'll get Oracle turn 61.  I presume that Mr Cairo will have finished it before then - war has probably stopped SD and Ruff, and possibly GKC and Krill.
I should have researched Masonry first, I think, in case Mr Cairo finishes it in the next few turns, priesthood was largely meaningless, though it does give a bonus to writing and CoL.

Here's the micro:



Clack moved down to pre-chop that forest, then to the other for a 3 turn chop, then back to finish.   I'll work a 2 hammer tile when it grows back to size 3.   This SHOULD get it done by T61.  I might whip it again at the end. PeterSagal is pasturing the cow. I think he'll road it after that.

My island got a lot better




FISHY!!!  Basically, thats Deadliest Catch latitude, so that's probably black cod up there (Deadliest catch is crab, I think).  Anyway, island goes from meh to instantly useful.  Can settle and get the fish online immediately with a workboat   Long term, it gets terrace, lighthouse, temple, probably a courthouse eventually, mainly through whip overflow, and probably runs merchants when we are in caste and whips out suicide cats in slavery. But mainly it gives me extra commerce on most of my cities...

I plan to send the workboat to scout out around Mr Cairo, hopefully doing so where he can't see that I'm doing it.  His culture may have grown enough so I can't help it, of course.

Krill's power continues to grow.   It would be kind of funny if Krill hit Superdeath while superdeath had no idea, cause he was bent on capturing my tech.  or, to be fair, he simply forgot.



My demos are great.   It's still early in the game, of course, but I'm pretty happy. Honestly, if I wasn't tops in that stuff, with 5 cities and a gold, I'd be pretty unhappy.

OnPoint whipped it's terrace.  it's take the clam next turn, I think.  
DeliciousDish is on a workboat and growth.

The axe in delicious dish went out to kill barbs.

[AutomatedTeller]

I can't drive turn 55!!!

The barb spear attacked my axe, which was on a hill in a forest.   Odds of .1% of victory for the spear.  My axe won, but took 60 hp!!  I chose to move back into my culture to heal - I think the warrior would die, but I'm not in the mood to risk losing an axe in that case. 

Turns out I get Masonry in 2, not 3, if I move science to 80%.   I currently get 35 commerce, so I can run at 80% without losing anything (28 for science, 7 for taxes)

Switched OnPoint to use the clam, CarTalk works wheat, lake, fp cottage and spice forest.  Grow and create axe next turn.

Me, Mr Cairo and Ruff are all basically the same power.  I suspect I pass them soon with 2 axes. 

AllThings has it's corn finish.  Grows in 3 turns - love +6 food

I'll whip the axe in waitwait next turn.



Demos at 80% research. mfg good is down cause OnPoint is working the clam, not copper.

of course, everyone has discounts on more buildings than I do...

[AutomatedTeller]

Turn 56, where a wonder is finally made!!


Mr Cairo finished the oracle.  Now, of course, I'm wishing I had not teched priesthood.  It will help with writing and CoL, at least.

Changed tech to sailing, which will take 5 turns at 50%.  
WaitWait changed to a temple.   I'll chop it, but let WaitWait grow.   At size 4, it'll grow slowly with a priest, but it will continue to grow and I'll put in a farm for it to grow on till it's max size.
Something is creating a settler for the island - not sure what yet.

I'm now 4th in power with my 3rd axe.



Also, found krill, right next to superdeath.