[Spoilers] REM and AdrienIer's thread of football, spamming and blaming it on the mod

[ReallyEvilMuffin]

Ok, so we deviated slightly from the thread there but Ad wanted a SIP whereas I wanted a SE. We simmed a lot of starts and the best we could get SIP was a fair bit slower than going to the plains hill and worker first. I will post screenshots of the sims later as we cannot post our WB/save files here.

I liked SIP for a canal possibility and 1 more river cottage, but the starting speed which we can snowball from would be too great to be ignored. Also with huts I am valuing exploration highly on this map and we get an earlier warrior and 2 before the settler which comes out earlier.

Whilst I get what Ad is saying with having lots of food is nice, I feel that save for building settlers we will be bumping up against our happy cap a lot early on and so is not as valuable as he feels. (I tend to look to the short term benefits, he looks for long term power)

To make the start viable we have to pick an agri mining civ to have the worker out and to get bronze on time, and with china gone korea is the only other option. We have assumed expansive here though which could be a downfall... We could have to resim a bit but the SIP was more dependent on expansive anyway, so I am sure we can cope without.

Our priority list of leaders is:
Shaka
Mehmed
(thinking time)

We want agg as a nice way to have border pops without needing to tech myst. And org would help late game plus we are expecting a lot of lighthouse and courthouse needs here.

More to come when we return!

[AdrienIer]

Our discussion was simple, I thought we should SIP to get access to both bodies of water and be able to share some of that seafood with our next cities. It would have meant a great capital in the long term and we'd have beelined civil service for bureaucracy. The plan would have been to take an exp leader first (Shaka would have been our first choice) and hope for a good Fishing-Mining civ to come back to us in the end (Rome being the best we could hope for but the least likely to remain unchosen). This was my best shot for the first settler

REM wanted to settle SE for the 2h spot and a better start. Indeed this is what he got after a few tries

It's definitely better, so I accepted. But this opening required Mining-Agriculture as starting techs so we couldn't take Shaka and hope for the last agri-min civ to remain unchosen for a 10th pick. So in the end we've taken Korea and I hope (please please please) that Shaka or Mehmed will still be there when the snake comes back to us. Else we'll have to improvise with Isabella or even Pacal. Normally I'd be thrilled to have Pacal but I've played him so much I'd rather go Joao than him I think (and he'd speed up our settler, hurray).

I'm still not sure if this is truly the best plan, I can't shut the voice in my head that tells me NOT to run away from resources, but the roll is diced now

PS : REM I just received 5 mails from you from earlier, somehow they took longer than the others to arrive, at least now you know you're not crazy, you did send them.

[pindicator]

Enjoying the discussion so far guys! Hope you enjoy the game and I'm looking forward to reading your thread

[AdrienIer]

AAAAAH A LURKER !

Seriously now, I'm glad you came in to break the monotony of our thread. We'll try to continue giving our thoughts on how things are going as often as possible.

[ReallyEvilMuffin]

Enjoying the discussion so far guys! Hope you enjoy the game and I'm looking forward to reading your thread

I agree, nice to have someone else post in the thread!

[ReallyEvilMuffin]

Hmm as for a third choice I would like to put hammurabi out there. I know it will put the first city back a bit but I think he is a great mix of traits.

If you are keen on exp (I think we will save a lot of workboat hammers and worker hammers, plus all the interesting buildings after) fin as you said is soild as gives us power especially with all the water tiles we will use, plus it offsets leaving the river with the capital nicely actually, although as we said earlier it is a little dry and ALWAYS used, it would be refreshing to have a change. However fin exp makes all gold buildings super cheap. We could run an upgrade attack quite efficiently with it. I think we should not throw out bismark as IND has been indirectly boosted now as well don't forget, and a GLH could be a nice way to power along a lot of city founding. Plus we will know everyone else but 1 leaders so we will have a good idea about the efficacy of chasing wonders.

Hmm I think if we cannot have shaka or mehmed, hammurabi would be my third choice. Followed by bismark/isabella on equal footing. I think with jao we will have trouble keeping our eco up to match the expansion as he expands even faster than before now and late game we will really struggle. I have been looking over the civic options more and with the nerf to slavery and the changes to others we will likely want to leave it faster, but also we will have less of an idea what will be best to go to and when. Therefore spiritual might be more valuable than usual if we make a bum civic change we are only stuck in it for 5 turns. plus if we unlock caste early we could use spiritual for border pops. I am interested in serfdom now with the boosted windmills and watermills, but I am not sure if it beats caste. Watermills and workshops get boosted early anyway don't forget. Spiritual to switch into slavery for a round or 2 of whipping then out into something else could be good play here.

[AdrienIer]

Short answer : yes. Long answer may or may not come after I sleep depending on whether I have anything to add.

[ReallyEvilMuffin]

I will sim a non exp opening later when I have some more time to see what we can get without it. I think it will slow us by 2-3 turns off the top of my head...

[ReallyEvilMuffin]

I got a settler with 1 worker, 1 warrior, 1 workboat 1 to be built with overflow on a size 2 capital turn 31 again with 3 chops and in slavery if going agg/org.

I think that is respectable! Looking good on the leader pick front also

[AdrienIer]

That's good enough IMO, so Hammurabi before Isabella ? Pacal and Darius are gone, it's not a big surprise obviously but with Boudica going first I was wondering if we'd see some more unexpected choices.