[Spoiler] RB Pitboss #2 - Shaka of Rome

[Whosit]

Nice summary of the communications there! Clear and concise - did enjoy that. Thanks.

I noticed that you said 6 Praets by Turn 60 a little way upthread - I also got the impression that you were going to discover IW on turn 60-62 - that would seem a fast or even time travelling praet production speed - was it correct?

Really interested to see how things pan out in your game! Love to comment more, but I hate the thought of giving accidental spoiler info...

Whoops! I surely meant T80 for the Praets, if I can get Iron hooked up quickly.

Anyway, appreciate the comments, even if they are brief. Hopefully I won't run into any unpleasant surprises, but I think that I may be able to wage war against Korea even with a lack of Iron. An Axeman/Spearman combo might be enough to handle Archers and Chariots if I have enough. We'll see.

[Kyan]

And here it is:



I feel like I'm artificially raising my post count, though in my defense, I need to post for like three people. It seems like larger teams might have more posts because their members may "discuss" things in their thread. Dunno. I really need to stop worrying about that, though.

Anyway, hopefully my reply is self explanatory. I wonder if Athlete has AH or Pottery . . . or both. He must have one of them for Writing's Pre-req, because I don't think he took the Meditation > Priesthood route.

Like Bob, i'm worried about saying much, however be aware that people are very actively reading your threads. quintuple posting or not!

[Whosit]

At Speaker's request, for posterity.

Overview:



Military Advisor:



Demographics:

[Jabah]

I think your 'original site' was in fact 1S of the mark (there was rice in the BFC as I think you had 2 foods tiles).

[Whosit]

I think your 'original site' was in fact 1S of the mark (there was rice in the BFC as I think you had 2 foods tiles).

You're right, I just never bothered moving the sign since I wasn't planning to settle in the real original site.

[Jabah]

I was writing it more because of the 50t milestones, it is probably better to correct it now so other players won't be confused later

[Whosit]

I was writing it more because of the 50t milestones, it is probably better to correct it now so other players won't be confused later

Meh. Let 'em be confused, heh heh.

OK, so I got another message from Athlete. I'll post it below as well as a drafted response, but first I want to muse on something else. The significance of the fact that Athlete has discovered Writing does not escape me. With Willem as their leader, the only Creative leader in the game, they get 1/2 price Libraries. I played ahead in my sims until I got Libraries (having done IW, Masonry, Pottery, Writing) and it made an enormous difference. I'm starting to worry that my plan will leave me horrendously backwards. I don't think I can quit the Iron Working path now, I have too much invested in it (emotionally/strategically, not really the beakers) to stop. But I think I will have to make Writing a priority after that. At least I get a discount because I know someone who knows it, right? Right?

To have any hope of getting the G. Library, I need these techs: Polytheism, Masonry*, Pottery*, Writing, Aesthetics, Literature.

*Not strictly required, but very, very helpful.

There is some temptation to go for Polytheism quickly to try and get Hinduism. I will admit, having a religion for extra happiness would be quite helpful. However, unless it's a very, very quick tech (probably not), going for Pottery > Writing may be better, or even straight into Writing. I'll have to test a bit more. I will also want a City to get the furs, probably 1NE of my "Original" spot, but I'll check that out, too. That will let Imperial Center grow to size 7, large enough to feed two Scientists. Regals Reach will not get a Library because it has practically zero income. Will have to see where I place other cities.

I basically need my future war against Korea to go nearly perfectly. I think that being able to secure the riverfront will make up for stagnating my economy in the short-run after I can fill the region with cottages. Anyway, going for Writing before Polytheism is probably the wiser move, although I am not seeing a lot more pre-calendar happy resources lying around. Perhaps I can manage to grab a later religion, like Judaism or Christianity if no one else makes that a priority.

Any spoiler free thoughts would be happily accepted.

Anyway, the letter:

Dear Whosit,

Thank you for the passage. When I logged into the game I was confronted with your OB request which I had gladly accepted. I did move Ellorrs to meet the wandering Korean first though so as you will see we are not yet inside your borders. Commencing next turn we shall gladly move as swiftly as possible using your road network through your lands.

Unfortuneately I do believe we have no further knowledge than you do as to potential metals and so are unable to aid you in securing any such commodity. However we have learned the domestication of animals and would agree that there do seem to be an abundance of horses around. As such we are attempting to train them to pull our warriors on platforms with wheels .

We do have a coastal city and would look forward to possibly sharing resources down the road. At this point we are unsure but it would appear when ready the Inca's will allow our ships to pass and hopefully yours (when you meet) as well so this is probably something that can happen.

Also I would like to propose an agreement re: espionage. Perhaps you would be interested in building some trust by agreeing that once we have each other's graphs we can stop spending our points on each other? We will not be applying any towards you in the short term as we have more pressing matters but when ready we would stop once your graphs have been obtained. You would be welcome to spend yours to obtain our graphs sooner than later if you did not want to prolong that.

Athlete for A/K
Ottomans

Plako actually moved his Warrior, so I'll let them know. Trading is still far off as I really won't prioritize Sailing until the G. Library is taken. As for the Espionage, I had already begun putting EP on them to this very purpose, so, well, you'll see my draft, won't you?

Dear Athlete and Kalin,

I would like to mention that the Koreans have moved their Warrior further east. So unless you want to try chasing him, it would probably be quicker just to move west through my territory until you reach Korean territory.

Regarding espionage, I would happily make an agreement along the lines you suggested. That was as much as I planned to invest, anyway. I seriously doubt that either of us are in a position to perform subterfuge upon the other, nor would we want to, so this seems like a very logical proposal. As you may have noticed, I have already begun spending espionage points on your civilization, but I will stop once I am able to see your demographics chart.

I cannot think of any additional, pressing matters at the moment, but I plan to stay in contact. I imagine that we will have more to discuss when we each contact more of the other civilizations out there in the world.

Best regards,

Whosit, Ruler of the Interim Imperium

So, yup. That's about it.

In about 12 more turns, I will know my fate in regards to Iron. With a second scout already on the road (note to self: Name him "Greedo"), I plan to check out more of the territory to the north and east of Regals Reach. I'd scout to the west, but as per my agreement with Korea, I cannot settle further west.

Oh, and I must let Korea know BEFORE THE END OF Turn 55 that I wish to allow the NAP to expire. So that's in about 4 turns. I wonder what their response will be?

I think that their army is composed of 4 Warriors and 2 Workers, compared to my 4 Warriors, 2 Scouts, 3 Workers, though I'm only about 90% sure. They have a Barracks in Seoul, so will probably be producing some more units, but if I can get a sizable force of Axemen and Spearmen by T66 . . . I think I can get 2 Axemen and 2 Spearmen . . . . Well, it's not sizable, but depending on what they build in that time, it might be a good starting point.

Though I think Korea has an advantage. With all those mined hills, Seoul can bring in quite a bit of production. Seoul and P'yongyang have enough food to be whipped a few times. I'm not in Slavery yet, but RR isn't really whipable, and I'm not sure if it would be worth it to whip Imperial Center very hard. So, basically, if they focus on it, they may have a larger army than me, but I may have the advantage in superior troops. Even 2 Axemen/2 Spearmen should be able to stand up to an Archer/Chariot combination if I stick to defensive terrain. I could also conduct a campaign of terror, pillaging their farms and mines, thereby hampering their productive capabilities all the while outproducing them. I think it could work, but I will closely track their production. In a couple more turns I should FINALLY get visibility on P'yongyang, so I can see what they make there. I know they whipped a monument not too long ago. Well, I figure they whipped a monument. They whipped something.

Worse comes to worse, I chop out more troops. I'd rather save those forests for more important things, but it might be a good idea. So, yeah. Pillage the crap out of Seoul. Dunno if I can spare the forces to go after P'yong, but I'm more concerned about their capital. They'll know I'm coming (long visibility), but . . . yeah. Still a bit of a ways away.

[Whosit]

Umm, lesse . . . .

Did some testing . . . oh, and played the actual Turn 51. Nothing special to report there. I think my tech path may be IW > Polytheism > Pottery > Writing > etc., unless Hinduism gets taken before I get there. It very well might, but so far only Buddhism has been founded, so there's a good chance that no one is going to bother with the religions.

I made up a plan for Regals Reach, though it is a work in progress. Basically, it will focus on hammers at first, but then I actually will farm that unirrigated rice and focus on growth until it's size 5, whereupon I'll max the hammers (a nice 17 hpt). I think I'll end up getting more production by growing it over 20 turns rather than, say, 50.

I also noticed that I should have 4 Axemen and 2 Spearmen by T67. Just enough to launch a raid! The downside is that I will literally have a skeleton defense, just 1 Warrior for each city (assuming 3 cities), but I should be able to pop a couple more Spearmen for defense fairly quickly. Spearmen first, assuming a fast counter-attack with Chariots.

I ran some combat sims, and my strike force will have no chance of taking a city so long as it has anything approaching a reasonable defense. I made up a worst-case scenario, giving Seoul 8 Archers and 4 Chariots (they could theoretically produce that many from the city at max production and no other projects), though I doubt plako will focus 100% on units for the next 25 turns.

Still, even a couple of Archers could make things tough. Granted, my sim gave Seoul walls, but close enough. I figure the best I can do is pillage everything in sight, aside from the crabs, while I (hopefully) spit out troops faster than Korea can, maybe even getting Praetorians soonish, and then take 'em down.

Though the plan could seriously backfire, as a prolonged war gives Korea nothing better to do than spam troops. Even if Seoul is reduced to only the crabs as an improved tile, it could whip out an Archer or something every time it grew, so I could end up facing many, many defenders. On the plus side, if they do that, they may bankrupt themselves, or I could capture/raze their other cities (if they aren't able to whip that often there). Basically, I will have to watch the espionage numbers and carefully consider my options. But at least a relatively quick strike is possible.

Like everything, I'll just have to see how it goes . . . . (I'm getting tired of saying that!)

[Square Leg]

You don't have to attack just because the NAP expires do you?

[Whosit]

You don't have to attack just because the NAP expires do you?

I don't have to, but I can. Basically, if Korea has not been building up their military, it might still be a good opportunity to strike.

Here's some pictures from the most recent turn. There have a been a few new discoveries, one of which may change my plans drastically.

Firstly, my capital seems to be doing well:



Thannos continues to be hounded by this bear. He ducked NW to try and shake it.



Spotted a Barbarian Warrior. My Scouts are going to be in danger soon, I think.



Finally:



But here's the kicker:



Copper. Copper that Korea could potentially grab. You'll see that I've marked a couple locations for denial purposes. I will spend the next few turns scouting out the region in more detail, but it's starting to look like certain resources are clustered in an area. I have a hunch that this may be most of the Copper near our starting areas. Dunno. And dunno where the Iron is going to be.

In any case, letting Korea get metal would be very, very bad for me. I think I may have to try and get another Settler out to claim one of these. I'm going to make some plans to build/chop one out of Regals Reach.

The NE location is the stronger location by far, with coastal access and no effective overlap with RR. But it isn't going to grab the copper any time soon, and Korea could plot down right next to the metal.

The lower location is much, much weaker (another one-off-the-coast location, due to the frickin' mountain). But it grabs the copper for sure, it can share the Rice with RR when the latter isn't using it, and it can technically work the fish, though I would need another coastal city somewhere to actually make a work boat. Plus, it's not technically any further West than I already am, so it's legal under my agreement with Korea. It would also grab the Marble, which isn't an awful deal for me since I wanted it, anyway, so two birds with one stone, I guess. It also will completely segment this area of the continent for me, so no one can get by without my permission.

The biggest problem is that, like Regals Reach, it has no economic benefits whatsoever. I'll probably end up mining the Copper location, slow-building a monument, and then working a couple 1-food coastal tiles just for some income. Yeah, it could be a decent production city, too, but I can't really afford that at the moment.

So, yeah, I'm gonna see how/when I can get a Settler out for this.