[LURKER THREAD] You're the best around

[spacetyrantxenu]

Well, looks like Mack won that game of chicken ... then took 5 2mn cities.

And then took four more this turn.

***

I intercepted an observer report from the war front from last turn. It wasn't pretty.

A large enemy forces approached the encampment as the furloughed soldiers relaxed at the camp site. One force had been camping on vacation, and the other force had been camping the turn, but either way they (finally!) both made it into the field before a full week had passed. The following mock ups recall the battle, where we can see the Turn Campers assailing the camp of the Vacation Campers, attacking from every angle.





The besieged drew up to fight, but alas, they had been outcamped and had to play first! They fired their charges, not knowing if they could ready another volley before being overrun by the approaching berserker swarm.




Of course they couldn't get off another round of shots, the enemy had camped the turn too well, after a week of preparing who could have survived the onslaught? Their men were too few, and their bayonets, alas, an insufficient replacement for what they needed most, time to reinforce.




As the body count mounted, the wounded and dying could only lament their general's decision to take a vacation at such a dangerous time. Didn't he know their vacation camp could be exposed? The only defense against a rival camper is to be a better camper! The enemy pressed onward.




The enemy pressed, and pressed, ultimately dividing the vacation campers into five scattered pockets of desperate defenders, fighting and dying to the last man between their tents. Inhuman, uncivilized scourge! Turn camping villians!



Surrounded, nothing left to do now but kill, and die. So the men fought, their bayonets flying and glistening with blood and gore, until they were overcome by the endless waves of enemy berserkers. As the last man died, he uttered a final lament, cursing his general for not sending reinforcements. Why had aid not come???

LAST SOLDIER: turnnnnn splittt.....ungh... [dies]

[pindicator]

How can you be sure he didn't just happen to get back from his vacation 30 min after 2metra played his turn?

EDIT: To be honest, after I relented to 2metra's camping and let him have the 2nd half of the turn in my war, I do feel a fair amount of schadenfreude in seeing him get out-camped here.

[GermanJoey]

I was thinkin' a bit about what mack's been doing, due to wondering why TBS doesn't just spam out settlers onto his northern coasts as fast as he can. What could possibly be the danger? Is he worried about mack or REM? Gotta be mack, as REM has been hopelessly idle all game. But isn't mack a half a world away?

But! I think TBS realized that mack realized some time ago that his long term position is precarious, both against TBS and also OH, who has the MoM (which of course is probably as good as all this other crap combined). So, he's already set back OH a bunch, and thus his next step will be to try to damage TBS somehow, probably when TBS eventually wars against Commodore to fully gain control of his continent. That's probably his real reason for jumping on 2metra vs going back after REM, his original target before he decided to turn around and mess with Old Harry.

Let me explain. According to the tracker, it looks like mack's taken 13 cities off 2metra so far, which, on the surface may appear to put mack in the position of a runaway. However, I still don't think that's gonna be anywhere near enough to overcome TBS's output because TBS is stacking so many passive bonuses.

like, look at this:



Between the Agg+Ikhanda, AP/S/SM Monasteries and Temples, Library Merc+Rep specs, and RP+Serfdom, one of TBS's size 2 iceballs will likely be more productive than a rather large city of mack's... and TBS is not running out of ice any time soon, not to mention the much greener hills in Pindicator's former territory. Losing the GA but gaining RP means that the city loses just 3 commerce and 1 hammer. Thus, when the Ikhanda is complete and the SM gold completely pays for the city's maintenance, the pure profit is 34 beakers per turn plus 12 hammers per turn, which could either be funneled into a unit or wealth. This is fucking ridiculous.

For comparison's sake, an identical city of mack's, assuming he isn't in serfdom but does have RP, would produce a total of 5.4 bpt, 7gpt, and 6hpt less... and, considering the effect on his slider (he'll be producing far less gold and thus have a lower slider, losing beakers from his libraries/academy/etc), this means that the city's contribution to the empire is roughly half of what TBS is getting. OTOH, mack wouldn't need as much infrastructure for such a city, not needing 170 of it, but then OTOHH, TBS spends 38 hammers less on the settler and then some of the infra comes from chops and gets accelerated by AP hammers. mack can also try growing to tall sizes onto Fin coast, which can be very lucrative. However, this horrible foodless map means that option will be very slow, compounded by needing to pay the full 100 hammers for the settler and another 120h for the granary and lh, so I can't believe that path will profit very quickly. Likewise, 2metra's been whipping hard and thus mack's gutted-out new cities will take a long time to get back to any sort of meaningful output.

Long story short, I don't think mack has a realistic chance of catching up to TBS unless he becomes *vastly* bigger than him, and he knows it, and that realization is what has made TBS so cautious about what would otherwise appear to be phantom threats. If mack can't win by being on top, he will try to knock the others down, and everything he does is a road towards that... the strike against 2metra is actually the first step of an invasion of TBS!

[Boldly Going Nowhere]

Good post, Joey. Xenu, you too. Really, this kind of turn camping ought to be penalized.

[2metraninja]

How can you be sure he didn't just happen to get back from his vacation 30 min after 2metra played his turn?

EDIT: To be honest, after I relented to 2metra's camping and let him have the 2nd half of the turn in my war, I do feel a fair amount of schadenfreude in seeing him get out-camped here.

I think you vastly underestimate my moral and conduct of honour, good sir. I addressed this already in your thread.

[Dreylin]

And second thing - maybe I am missing something in general here. I do not know what I did to deserve you calling me a dick (well, still better than "рussy") but I had plan to take this island city of yours and even since I made up my mind about attacking you, I started to maintain a turn order with you, i.e. playing after you. Isn't this what I am supposed to do by the RB honor code of behavior?

(Moved the conversation in here)

You're certainly not the only one with that interpretation, but I think that the current site agreement is that turn order only matters on the turn before war is declared.

[2metraninja]

...
I think that the current site agreement is that turn order only matters on the turn before war is declared.

Cheers, mate.
That is funny, because I am sure I was called a dick (or worse) few times already for playing by this rule before

To all those who actually think this is such a big issue (intentionally or not intentionally), I must tell you guys, you should probably channel your energy and thoughts in a better/more positive direction, by either getting yourself better, so you do not have to seek excuses for your failures in the others with such a small and imaginary matters, or you get off your own-built high-morale tower from which you can suspect, judge and shame everyone for imagined sins and vices they inevitably have according to your own high self-opinion.

[Boldly Going Nowhere]

Feel better?

[pindicator]

I don't mind turn camping the turn before a war to get the spot you want. Attacker should be given that privilege IMO, since defending is innately easier to do.

But I don't think a player should intentionally camp a timer every turn to prevent a would-be attacker from getting the window he is looking for. That's just being a dick. I assumed that was what you were doing, if I was wrong then I apologize.

[2metraninja]

Then I accept your apology.