PBEM XII Map thread

[Mardoc]

* Unrestricted Leaders? Yes!

* Game speed? Quick

* Starting era? Ancient

* Orthus: on or off? On

* Acheron: Off

* Human take-over allowed for Basium and/or Hyborem? Yes

* Difficulty level? Emp

* Barb activity level? Up to mapmaker

* Wildlands? off

* Last Days? off

* Living World? Yes

* Lairs? YES

* All Unique Features? Up to mapmaker

* Map type? Up to mapmaker

* Always War/Diplomacy allowed? No/Yes

* Leader Duplicates allowed? yes

* Snake pic? No, top 3 choices.

[Mardoc]

I'll be working on this as soon as I have the civ picks, but first I'd like to address the 'Up to Mapmaker' options:

Script - I'm debating between Pangaea and Inland Sea. Probably going to end up Pangaea. Whichever I do, I'll aim to balance it by adding stuff, not by taking away so we end up slightly lush. I will be adding some islands so that naval warfare/OO is an option.

The other possibility I'm considering is Lakes, but that seems almost too common around here. On the other hand, that could be for a reason.

Any opinions here? Remember, I'm looking most of all to meet their goal of natural, with a secondary bonus of lush.

Barbs - I'm thinking normal Emperor barbs will be enough, there's no need to make them Raging (and it's not really FFH if they're off, plus that would gimp anyone who's gambling on a Barbarian leader).

Uniques? Yes, they'll be in. I'm debating what to do about the Big 3 and also the explorable ones; I don't want either to be near enough to someone to warp the game, or else I want to put one next to everyone. If anything, I think the explorable lairs seem to change the game more than dragon bones/remnants - a super early Big Bad or Great Person does a lot more than a single good tile to work.

I think I may put the unique explorables in the middle and guard *them* with Pristinus Pass, actually; leaning toward separating the Big three and putting them equidistant between pairs of players.

The other unique that will need careful handling is Letum Frigus. Right now I'm leaning toward putting it on an island with no food but no guardian either. Or maybe it would work to have it guarded by Drifa, assuming no one goes Illians?

Any opinions/objections?

[Selrahc]

or else I want to put one next to everyone.

While I'm sure it's not what you're thinking.. the idea of giving everybody all three of the Big 3 within a close radius strikes me as an interesting one. So that cities 2, 3 and 4 could possibly all have one of the big three for each player. Seeing how they prioritize the settling of each one, and whether people will push for Patria or Yggdrassil or Dragon Bones first.

[DaveV]

The other unique that will need careful handling is Letum Frigus. Right now I'm leaning toward putting it on an island with no food but no guardian either. Or maybe it would work to have it guarded by Drifa, assuming no one goes Illians?

I like the idea of the guardian; if the island is empty and the barbs build a city there, anyone with OO would have easy access.

Selrahc's idea is cool, but you'd have to make very sure the uniques are completely out of range of first-turn scouting. Having Patria or Yggsgadril at the capital would be a potentially game-winning boost.

Has the map size been specified? That will make a big difference in game play: smaller size favoring rushing civs, larger size favoring builders.

A completely off-the-wall suggestion for map script: SevenSpirit's Hall of Mirrors script. Somewhat fails the "natural" criterion, but at least people wouldn't be able to complain about unbalanced starts.

[Azoth]

Inland Sea is my favourite mapscript and it hasn't yet been used for a FFH PBEM, so that's what I would suggest. It produces 'natural' maps that are both easy to balance and rather lush, with many rivers and floodplains. Any islands, powerful features, and guardians can be placed in the universally accessible central sea.

As for the "Epic Dungeon" Unique Features, I would garrison them with a single Held barbarian unit. To better accommodate the Clan of Embers and the Barbarian trait, the dungeon guardians should not be Orc units (so that they can't be claimed by the Clan worldspell) and should have the Hidden Nationality promotion (so that Barbarian leaders can attack them freely.) Some suggestions:

Pyre of the Seraphic: Azer
Bradeline's Well: Tar Demon
Broken Sepulcher: Wraith

[Mardoc]

What I know so far:

Krill/Kyan-Clan of Embers - Kandros Fir
Amelia-Elohim???
Elimist/Mist-Sidar - Varn Gosam
Square Leg-Hippus
Sareln-Sheaim
Serdoa/WarriorKnight-Illians - Varn?

I like the idea of the guardian; if the island is empty and the barbs build a city there, anyone with OO would have easy access.

Apparently Drifa's off the table, but I could pull out Margalard again.

Selrahc's idea is cool, but you'd have to make very sure the uniques are completely out of range of first-turn scouting. Having Patria or Yggsgadril at the capital would be a potentially game-winning boost.

It would be very cool. It would also really strain the mandate for 'natural'. I think I would simply get complaints.

Plus, that's another piece that makes the map about me, not about the players. It would be essentially dictating a right answer for city 2 location.

Has the map size been specified? That will make a big difference in game play: smaller size favoring rushing civs, larger size favoring builders.

Normal with Low sea level. Slightly more room than average, especially for 6, but not too big.

A completely off-the-wall suggestion for map script: SevenSpirit's Hall of Mirrors script. Somewhat fails the "natural" criterion, but at least people wouldn't be able to complain about unbalanced starts.

People will always find something to complain about. If I hadn't been yelled at by Bob for taking a Donut and making it look natural, I might consider that. But Amelia, for one, specifically called that out as something he doesn't want to see this time.

Inland Sea is my favourite mapscript and it hasn't yet been used for a FFH PBEM, so that's what I would suggest. It produces 'natural' maps that are both easy to balance and rather lush, with many rivers and floodplains. Any islands, powerful features, and guardians can be placed in the universally accessible central sea.

My only real fear here is making OO too strong. But I think I'm leaning this direction anyway.

As for the "Epic Dungeon" Unique Features, I would garrison them with a single Held barbarian unit. To better accommodate the Clan of Embers and the Barbarian trait, the dungeon guardians should not be Orc units (so that they can't be claimed by the Clan worldspell) and should have the Hidden Nationality promotion (so that Barbarian leaders can attack them freely.) Some suggestions:

Pyre of the Seraphic: Azer
Bradeline's Well: Tar Demon
Broken Sepulcher: Wraith

Now this suggestion I really like It essentially sets a timer on them that prevents them from being explored until someone can deal with the results. And also until a single Great Person isn't quite as game-altering. I'll probably throw a few Combat promos on each of these, too.

Any further thoughts on Letum Frigus, now that Illians are chosen? I'm inclined to make it just the same as I would have done - that is, stick it on an island with a guardian. Anything else becomes a question of whether I'm favoring them too much or not enough. That way if they're willing to work for their Aggressive trait, they still can get it, but everyone else will have a chance at Ice mana too.

[Selrahc]

Krill/Kyan-Clan of Embers - Kandros Fir
Amelia-Elohim???
Elimist/Mist-Sidar - Varn Gosam
Square Leg-Hippus
Sareln-Sheaim
Serdoa/WarriorKnight-Illians - Varn?

I did receive leader choices with Amelia, SL and Sareln's leaders.
SL wanted Amelanchier
Sareln wanted Kandros Fir
Amelia wanted Kandros Fir for the Elohim, or Perpentach for the Grigori.

[Mardoc]

So that makes it, in order:


Sareln - Kandros Fir - Sheaim
Ellimist - Varn Gosam - Sidar
Amelia - Kandros Fir for the Elohim, or Perpentach for the Grigori, depending on people's votes
Serdoa - Likely Varn - Illians
Square Leg - Amelanchier - Hippus
Krill - Kandros Fir - Clan of Embers.

[uberfish]

Putting islands with some of the world features on an inland sea should be pretty interesting and enable more interaction between non-adjacent players. Equal access to Letum Frigus and the like.

I wouldn't worry about OO being too strong, it has not seemed overpowered in any previous game.

Also: Amelanchier of Hippus? WTH?

[Mardoc]

Also: Amelanchier of Hippus? WTH?

+20% withdrawal chance from Homeland + Horselord. He may not have much of an economy or the latest tech, but his horses just won't die.

Well - I suppose we'll see if that works. I presume that's the thinking, though.