I'm playing this game yet again

[Charr Babies]

D2R is on sale at least every other month for up to 50% off. Well worth the entry fees. I just bought my copy for C$22

[T-hawk]

I don't have a computer to run D2R - mine is Windows 7 32-bit with a GPU from 2013. I could build a new one but haven't had enough reason to. And I like playing an old game where I know all the mechanics rather than guessing what's going to be messed around with in the next patch.

[KingOfPain]

I don't have a computer to run D2R - mine is Windows 7 32-bit with a GPU from 2013.  I could build a new one but haven't had enough reason to. 

That is amusing and amazing at the same time.

[KingOfPain]

That looks like a lot of writing all at once, and I got sidetracked to the Jungle Map Guide... I only got thru the build intro so far but I like it that you are trying to bring back appropriate stat points distribution instead of dump all the Vit

[Meiz]

Very intresting read once more. Could you post an update here once the next chapter is up?

[T-hawk]

Long delay for a variety of reasons, but act 2 is up now. Mostly because I've already played all but one character through act 3, since I was looking to see if anyone found any better equipment options before committing to some choices after act 2 (spending particular runes and socket quests.) I didn't want the narrative to jump back and forth so this was the cleanest way to do it.

http://dos486.com/diablo/starteam5/hell.shtml

[Kylearan]

I've decided to read your report along while I'm playing roughly the same act and not skip ahead; I can relate to it much better when I'm at the same stage of the game. That means I'll be lagging behind (I'm almost done playing Hell act 1 while you seem to be two acts ahead) and thus my comments will be quite late; I hope you won't mind. It's a great read so far, I like that you spend so much time talking about the reasons behind your decisions!

So, a couple of comments and questions about your act 1 report:

[...] and in stash he has Rose Branded (+3 combat skills) scepter+shield+circlet+amulet for prebuffing Holy Shield [...]
[...] Enchant pre-buff equipment in stash (Leaf staff, +2 circlet, +3 amulet, +1 skill charm [...]

Do you take the time to switch all this equipment for pre-buffing each time the buffs run out, or only for particular difficult fights? Sounds like a lot of work to me, even though I can see how this is probably quite an improvement.


We've already discussed a bit our different rulesets with regards to shopping at vendors, but holy cow I didn't realize just how much of a difference this makes! I've only really thought about it in terms of bases for runewords and how I wouldn't shop for those, but besides that you also have lots of "of the whale" items, cruel greater talons, godly ornate plates for your all your mercs, pre-buffing items like Echoing weapons, ...  You sure remove a good chunk of entropy from the random loot aspect of this game. 

I don't mean to judge; it's just different tastes for how we enjoy playing the game. For me, when doing a playthrough with no area reruns, the best part is how to deal with the drops the game gives you, making the best out of the randomness which often forces you to deal with certain gaps in equipment in creative ways. (Besides variant play, this is what I've always loved about any kind of roguelike.) Shopping removes parts of this, in that it guarantees you certain abilities in certain slots, like a guaranteed +6 to warcries or extra life from of the whale suffixes. That's akin to wearing casual Griefs for this format!  (I'm exaggerating of course.)

Although, on the other hand I gladly use any of the "new" runewords which you don't, which in a way also guarantee certain abilities at least for mid-range runes that you are almost guaranteed to find, so I'll better shut up now.


Oooh, Delirium sounds like a lot of fun! I've always thought the chance to become a doll would mean certain death, but I guess I've never read up on its precise mechanics and it isn't so bad after all. And bosses cursing monsters is hilarious.


Sorry if I missed it, but what were the assassin's skills at the beginning of Hell roughly, and do you remember what the damage on her claws were? I'm playing my assassin right now, and while she's slower than my other chars, I've found her to be better than I feared even with only exceptional claws, so I'd like to get a feeling about your stats for comparison. She's definitely one of the more fun characters to play, with her being the exact opposite of "hold right mouse button to win".


I've also read your introduction to act 2 already:

[...] p1 is always the best payout ratio of items per monster toughness.

I understand for this format with no reruns, playing at p1 gives obviously more loot than skipping an area entirely (and that's something I plan to do as well, now that I'm in Hell). But what do you mean by "best payout ratio" in this context?

[T-hawk]

(I'm almost done playing Hell act 1 while you seem to be two acts ahead) and thus my comments will be quite late; I hope you won't mind.

Heh, sure. I started before you in real time - this team started last November, actually over a year ago now; I haven't been playing as much in real time as with my earlier teams during the pandemic.

Do you take the time to switch all this equipment for pre-buffing each time the buffs run out, or only for particular difficult fights?

Yes. Only for the buffs that last ten-plus minutes, which are Holy Shield and Enchant, or high-level summons like Valkyrie for this bowazon and Grizzly and Iron Golem for previous teams. Not for shorter buffs like Battle Orders or Fade/Venom or low-level summons, for those I just use what fits on switch. Particularly important for the sorceress is that she doesn't have to keep her Enchant pre-buff equipment on switch, so that slot can hold her physical damage weapon instead.

We've already discussed a bit our different rulesets with regards to shopping at vendors, but holy cow I didn't realize just how much of a difference this makes! ... You sure remove a good chunk of entropy from the random loot aspect of this game. 

I had the feeling that you weren't quite realizing how much there is to get from vendors, glad you finally did. I don't view it as me removing the entropy - the game system already did.

Heh, you mention Nethack... I've been wanting to try playing that game seriously for about 20 years and haven't gotten around to it. The farthest I ever got was getting killed by the Medusa on about level 25. Although what turns me off is that it's built around 1st-edition D&D mechanics that are extremely dated compared to any modern game (either computer or paper RPG.)

Shopping removes parts of this, in that it guarantees you certain abilities in certain slots, like a guaranteed +6 to warcries or extra life from of the whale suffixes.

I see your point. But I'd say there's not really a difference there. As you say, there's plenty of things that are likely enough to be guaranteed anyway, like Spirit.

Although I'd describe the difference like this: vendor shopping doesn't take away options, ladder runewords do. Spirit, Insight, Obedience, Grief are so one-right-choice that nothing ever beats them. That's not true for the vendor items; those claws and ornate plates don't cut off any strategic choice, there's still plenty of ways to do better from the random item system. The +3 skill buff items might be an exception, but there's no tradeoff there anyway; you still want the highest skills and nothing else, so avoiding vendors just makes it harder to get the same thing. And are you really going to pick up every magical blue-text item to identify to see if it's Echoing or Cunning or Rose Branded?

Oooh, Delirium sounds like a lot of fun! I've always thought the chance to become a doll would mean certain death

It really doesn't. It just turns off your attack skill, but all your defense and buffs and summons/merc stay intact. So as long as you can run out of combat, you're fine. That said, I would still only use it on a ranged or high-defense character of a class who doesn't have other crowd control, so that pretty much limits it to amazon or paladin.

Sorry if I missed it, but what were the assassin's skills at the beginning of Hell roughly, and do you remember what the damage on her claws were?

This is a pure Dragon Claw build: that, Claw Mastery, Fade, Venom all maxed. This is a single-target attacker, not at all the same as your elemental assassin, for whom the claw damage doesn't matter. This build is indeed rather boring, hold the right mouse button to win. The claw base damage is around 120 average and the character screen says roughly 1200, although half of that is Venom, and there are crits and crushing blow on top of that.

I understand for this format with no reruns, playing at p1 gives obviously more loot than skipping an area entirely (and that's something I plan to do as well, now that I'm in Hell). But what do you mean by "best payout ratio" in this context?

Yeah, I said that badly, but I was trying to write it short instead of a long explanation. What I'm referring to is how the item drop chance per monster increases with player count less than linearly. Killing one monster or clearing one area on players-3 takes the same effort as doing two on p1, but the latter gives a higher expected count of item drops, so more payout per monster toughness. I'll give more detail on the math if you want it.

[KingOfPain]

Delirium on a shapeshifter (Druid or any class with Beast) works great.

[T-hawk]

Acts 3 and 4 are up, same link (scroll down to it) http://dos486.com/diablo/starteam5/hell.shtml