Turn Discussion Thread

[HitAnyKey]

Oh, heh. I see you logged in and played the turn while I was typing all that up. Oh well.
I didn't have any major objections to the things you had stated originally. More just questioning some of them. We'll see how things play out from them. I am still wondering about doing sailing first, but maybe that is the better idea. I'd like to hear your more detailed thoughts on it, since you have a better mind for the micromanaging of the turns and how to plan further in advance.

Ok, I see Capra is safe (only a Fast Worker near him) so I'm happy for that.
I see you changed Animal Farm to make a Worker instead of an Axe? I guess I'll wait for the turn report that you are probably writing right now to see why you did that. I thought we need as many axes as possible as fast as possible. Especially since I see Pirates now have an Axe of their own in Barbados. Which means they'll start moving axes to Tortuga and churning out more, and probably before we can attack. If we don't get axes over there to take Tortuga before they get an axe in place, then we're in trouble. Because an Axe on that hill city, will be very difficult to kill.

[TheHumanHydra]

I am the prophesied new member. I have now read (I think) everything in this forum and in the main demogame forum. Right now I need to go to bed; tomorrow I will post first with some comments about my prospective role and then later (hopefully) with some observations on the game, if I can process everything that I've read. For now I'll say that it looks like I've stepped into something interesting and exciting, though I'm quite intimidated. I'll part with just a simple question; could someone direct me to a short list or summary of the game settings and rules? I could not find this anywhere, though I think I have surmised many of the rules from the conversations.

Talk to you tomorrow,

TheHumanHydra

[TheHumanHydra]

As promised, some comments on my prospective role. When I first signed up for this game, I assumed I would be one of many posting in a team with clear leaders and all of the key roles filled. I (as a multiplayer newbie) would be able to contribute and learn with the assurance that the game was in good hands that didn't actually need my help - no pressure for my first foray into multiplayer! Well, we seem to have clear leaders, but not many others, and not all of the key roles are filled! That's all right; I didn't pick the team with the least number of players not to become involved! As such, I will try to contribute regularly, and would perhaps be willing to take on one of those key roles. With that said, in consideration that I am a newbie and that the situation is not what I was expecting, I would ask you to go easy on me, both in terms of time commitment and competence. Especially if I take on one of the key roles, I need the freedom to say stupid stuff in discussion and to make mistakes that will cost us in the game. I hope that that makes sense and is agreeable. Let me know if it doesn't, or isn't.

About said key roles - as I understand them, they are, roughly:

Turnplayer - looks like Mortius and HitAnyKey are sharing this one. I would strongly prefer not to fill this role at any point; I don't trust myself with that responsibility, and feel I would make too many mistakes.

Economic planning - looks like Mortius has taken the lead on this one. I would be willing to help out with this if directed to, but I can't say it's my strong suite (I hardly use Slavery in my offline games, which is apparently key, for instance; somehow I've made it to Emperor, and counting!).

Military planning - looks like Mortius is doing this one too. Again, I would be willing to help out with this, though I have no idea how effective I would be at it (I study war in real life [like, actually study it, not just read books], but Civilization is not real war, and beating up the AI is too easy to properly assess my skills). This one would certainly be exciting, however.

Cloak and dagger - no one is doing this one. I can't say I'm eager to take it up either; it looks way over my head, but if it's the most pressing need, I could try my hand at it. No guarantees of accuracy or of any useful information whatsoever if I do, though.

Diplomacy - Lord Parkin appears to be conveying the messages, and random people appear to be responding. This may be where I am best suited to focus my attention, though I am not good at reading lies and smokescreens, and prefer straightforward and honest diplomacy. Depends on what you're looking for in a diplomat.

City and unit naming - Uh, nope. If it were left up to me, all the units would be named "Axeman 1," "Axeman 2," etc., for ease of use. I don't think I'm suited to this one.

All right, that was rather long. Have I left any roles out? What are your thoughts on where I could best be used? I will try to post later today with some observations on our current in-game situation as well. Take care,

TheHumanHydra

[HitAnyKey]

Military planning - looks like Mortius is doing this one too. Again, I would be willing to help out with this, though I have no idea how effective I would be at it (I study war in real life [like, actually study it, not just read books], but Civilization is not real war, and beating up the AI is too easy to tell where my skills lie). This one would certainly be exciting, however.

Diplomacy - Lord Parkin appears to be conveying the messages, and random people appear to be responding. This may be where I am best suited to focus my attention, though I am not good at reading lies and smokescreens, and prefer straightforward and honest diplomacy. Depends what you're looking for in a diplomat.

My first thought is that Diplomacy is where we could use the most help. If for nothing else than just writing up fun nice messages (some people enjoy doing fancy in-character diplomacy style writing) for being sent to the teams to detail what we need said.
In each of the diplo threads we discuss what our plans and goals are with each team, and when messages need to be sent we would need to try to talk out the aspects of what we need each message to "say". Then we would need someone to actually say it.
Both Mortius and myself seem to often be able to come up with things that we might want to get said to the other teams, but often neither of us get around to actually writing it. Mortius would prefer not to since he’s often stated that he’s not that great at writing stuff like that (and I think he’s stated his use of the English language gets misconstrued at times). And for me, I tend to just not like writing and procrastinate on trying to write something up until Mortius gets frustrated waiting for me and writes it up himself.

As for Military, I'm thinking just keep voicing your thoughts on what you think we might want to do for various instances that come up throughout the game and all that. Like if there's a certain target you think we should go for, where you think we might need better defenses, stuff like that. Mortius seems to be our resident expert on the technicals and knowing the combat odds and other such things like that, but if we're helping "make the decisions" then I think that'll help take off some of the pressure that he's been feeling lately of having to almost play the game himself.

[TheHumanHydra]

My thoughts echo yours. We'll see what Mortius and any others say.

Now for some observations on the state of the game. Despite play on our part that I'm quite impressed with, I think the Pirates have put us in bad position and that this may be the crisis moment of the game for us. If we don't take Tortuga, I think we're doomed to be a second-rate power and (barring good fortune) eventually swallowed up by one of the other teams, probably the Pirates. I can explain if anyone would like; I may be totally wrong, as I am a newb. My recommendation may come across as drastic, but it follows from the above: I recommend that we move all our military units, even those on defensive duties, to Tortuga to give us the greatest possible chance of taking the city. The only unit I would exclude is Warrior 4 (Ovis), due to distance. I also think we need to do an analysis of whether the probability of taking the city would be greater if we used our workers to chop out additional axes or build roads and attack with those we have sooner. That said, I'm not sure but I don't think we can take the city before at least one enemy axe has reached it. Can we take the city in a timely manner if this is the case? If so, how, and if not, do we have a plan?

[HitAnyKey]

Mortius, I'm hoping you will post something before the turn flips. I'm trying to figure out your logic behind why Animal Farm is making a Worker and not an Axeman. We need Axes for the battle, or we are not going to be able to take that city. They are about to pile in another Quechua before our first axe can get there and probably even get their first Axe in there also before we can attack the first time. Without lots of Axes, we're going to be doomed.

I just logged in and I see that none of our warriors drew their Quechua's out to attack, which is both good and bad. Good in that our units are still alive, but it would have been better to slow down their reinforcements or remove their fortification bonus.


They have 2 Quechua's in Tortuga, another one two tiles away, and their axe would currently be on the newly roaded plains tile (along with the 2 Quechua's that are protecting the 2 Workers making the road) that is 2 SW from Barbados. That Axe will be in Tortuga in 2 more turns.

I agree with THH. We need to get all our warriors to Tortuga FAST, including Sus.

[TheHumanHydra]

I second switching Animal Farm's production back to Axes. We need to take that city.

Contingency plans: if we can't take the city, what if we settle 1S of the gold to deny them that resource (the reason for founding the city); it's not that bad of a city-site, though 2S or 1S, 1SE would have been better. We could additionally settle 1SW of the Ivory to secure that resource (vital to us) and provide a defensible block on the way to our capital. That said, sooner rather than later either we or the Pirates are going to have to go; we can't have them sitting on our doorstep like that all game. Let's try and take the city now.

[timski]

(In the tech thread Mortius requested access to this forum. Their lack of posts here subsequently rather suggests they have not been granted access.)

[HitAnyKey]

(In the tech thread Mortius requested access to this forum. Their lack of posts here subsequently rather suggests they have not been granted access.)

No, he has access. That was the very first thing I did. I gave him access even before he requested it himself. I also sent him an email.

[HitAnyKey]

I second switching Animal Farm's production back to Axes. We need to take that city.

Yeah, since I hadn't heard from Mortius before I went to bed last night, I switched it back to the Axe. Nowhere in any of his previous posts or plans did I ever see mention of making a Worker, so I put it back so as not to mess up war plans.
We'll have that Axe in 3 turns. We could also whip him, but I don't know what that will do to our longer term plans. I don't know how to do the calculation of how long it would take the city to regrow back from yet another 2-pop whip so soon after our last one. It might be worth it to get out the Axe immediately, and have the overflow go into another Axe.