RBPBEM FfH V [SPOILERS] Sareln of the Amurites

[Sareln]

[serious] I don't see a settler in your current build plans am I missing something? or are you planning on an OCC for the near term? [/serious]

I lack roads, and the Clan's intentions are unclear, I'll put out 2 more warriors or so (to bring the count to 7) and then push out a settler to go south. This will make me slower than most, but I'll need the extras to settle that close to the gobbo fort.

[spellman]

Silly goblins.

[Sareln]

Turn 42:

Scout gets predictably munched on, I finish the 2nd plantation and move 2 warriors to cover the worker against the lizardman. The warrior in the jungle is C2 and will heal up at end of turn (and go to full Fortify bonus) he's there to pick off the lizardman after it attempts the 2 warriors. I'll be popping out another warrior at end of turn as well. There's a poison goblin loitering out of range of this confrontation, the extra warriors I build will deal with him.

My capital has hired a scientist for the faster research. After I pick up crafting I'll start straight-in on mining. Tredje has until after I finish mining to convince me that he's not coming for my throat (T50). If I'm not satisfied I'll be going to BW -> Education -> Conquest after mining. When the Great-Scientist pops 22 turns), I have the choice to either use him for an academy or for KotE immediately. I want to use him for an academy in the capital, but war footing will demand that I pop him for KotE.

If I'm feeling safe, then the tech order will be Education -> Exploration ->BW

[Sareln]

YACWB:

Synopsis: Congratulate Bob for his double-revolt to GodKing/Agrarianism, talk about how Tredje isn't talking. Bob mentions that he can see the wolf rider, I mention my worker-preservation force, we both agree to mention it to each other if Tredje mentions the other.

(6:26:00 PM) Sareln: gratz on the double revolt btw
(6:26:14 PM) BobChllingsworth: thanks
(6:27:12 PM) BobChllingsworth: Next turn should be interesting... Tredje is 2NW of my expansion with a wolf rider
(6:27:26 PM) BobChllingsworth: I have guys defending, but I still don't like him being so close
(6:27:41 PM) Sareln: naturally
(6:28:07 PM) Sareln: I've taken to having at least 2 warriors stacked on my worker so that if he wanted to try and poach, I'd be able to run away.
(6:29:08 PM) BobChllingsworth: I wouldn't care if I thought he was just scouting my borders, but he's had an active thread and been silent since first contact
(6:29:26 PM) BobChllingsworth: and he has already scouted the area before
(6:29:30 PM) Sareln: it's curious
(6:30:06 PM) Sareln: he actually replied to my "talk to me" e-mail with an offer to meet for chat, but hasn't responded otherwise to my response giving a time (he didn't show up btw).
(6:30:11 PM) Sareln: dunno if it's just comm trouble or what
(6:30:43 PM) BobChllingsworth: odd. Well, if I come up in any chat you do have with him, I'd certainly be appreciative if you gave me a heads up
(6:31:03 PM) BobChllingsworth: I'd do the same for you if he and I start talking again and you're mentioned
(6:31:45 PM) BobChllingsworth: I'm more worried about his aggressive trait than anything having to do about the Clan, at least for right now
(6:32:07 PM) Sareln: yeah, +20% on all units is rough to deal with.
(6:32:40 PM) Sareln: thanks, btw, I'll do the same.

[Nyktorion]

Still reading your thread

Second city indeed seems quite slow to me, but with city size 6 and that many farms, further settlers beyond that should come quite quickly, then. What are your general ideas about the speed of further cities after the second ones? Or in other words, how much other stuff do you plan to get inbetween?

[NobleHelium]

How does KotE contribute to a near-term war, exactly? I think the Amurites get metamagic, fire, and body from the palace - haste is nice but it doesn't seem all that useful for an early defensive war. I don't see any major use from the other two spells either this early in the game. Visibility is nice, but a lot more useful when you have mobile units to take advantage of the information.

[Sareln]

How does KotE contribute to a near-term war, exactly? I think the Amurites get metamagic, fire, and body from the palace - haste is nice but it doesn't seem all that useful for an early defensive war. I don't see any major use from the other two spells either this early in the game. Visibility is nice, but a lot more useful when you have mobile units to take advantage of the information.

Haste makes the units mobile to take advantage of the visibility . More seriously though, Iskender and I are talking about a trade for his Enchantment mana in the event of a clan attack. Enchanted Blade's +20% would mostly negate the clan's aggressive advantage (they'd still get shock earlier than me).

[Sareln]

Still reading your thread

Second city indeed seems quite slow to me, but with city size 6 and that many farms, further settlers beyond that should come quite quickly, then. What are your general ideas about the speed of further cities after the second ones? Or in other words, how much other stuff do you plan to get inbetween?

Hoping to go warrior -> settler -> worker -> warrior/growth -> settler.

Doesn't make sense to settle the Gems/Sugar spot until after BW (so that I can chop forests). If I get an agreement/NAP from the clan, I can go north to the mirror instead (lay some farms and cottages since BW will be delayed and education advanced).

[Sareln]

Diplomacy:

Intriguing from Iskender. Perhaps this is why the Clan was so hard to get ahold of for a spell then?

[COLOR="Gray"]Hey

I wanted to share this with you once we have a NAP so here it goes: I have a world spell NAP with the Clan. Initially I made the Clan an offer to coordinate our world spells and target one player. They suggested Amurites, which I refused and suggested the Luchuirp instead, which in turn was rejected by Trardoc who claimed they need to take care of 'tensions in the south' first. As a result the idea was abandoned, but we agreed not to use our world spells against each other (but please keep it between us).

I don't think there's an immediate threat from the Clan. They probably want to research Bronze Working and maybe Masonry before switching to military mode, which means at least a dozen more turns before they start producing military, more if they also want to use Warrens.

My scout spotted a C2 Clan Wolf Rider 10 tiles south of Luchuirp lands. Do you think they might have a business in the south, maybe connected with Bob's effort to box them in?


Good luck with your exams!

Iskender

[/COLOR]

[Sareln]

Diplomacy:

Raw chat with Tredje. I'm going to make Breakfast before putting in the synopsis. I don't think I gave away the farm, though it was certainly more fair than I wanted it to be. If I can get the NAP to go with the settling aggrement, that should give me the space/time to get out to about 5.5 cities and get to magic and tech advantage over the clan.

Synopsis: Tredje and I agree in principle to a line about Odio's Prison. I ask for and get acquiesence to settle just below Odio's Prison, but am unable to convince him to accept another city across that line. It's fair on paper, but I think is better for Tredje. He's now taken the deal to Mardoc, to check with him. I offer up the consideration of an NAP if he finds the settling terms agreeable and put a time-table of 5 turns to come back with an answer (this is when mining will come in for me and I need to decide where to go from there).

(9:30:18 AM) Sareln: hey, am still working on this story about PB's hanging, but let's talk; you free?
(9:30:42 AM) Tredje: Yes
(9:30:44 AM) Tredje: I am
(9:31:07 AM) Tredje: Let me fire up the game
(9:31:58 AM) Sareln: good idea, I should do that as well.
(9:35:31 AM) Sareln: alright, I've got my game open. You?
(9:35:48 AM) Tredje: yeah, doing a quick sketch in paint
(9:36:51 AM) Sareln: 'kay
(9:37:53 AM) Tredje: Let's talk distance first.
(9:38:58 AM) Tredje: I think that the diagonal line running alongside Odio's prison represents the halfway point between us, correct?
(9:39:06 AM) Sareln: something like 14 across and 3 or 4 down
(9:39:22 AM) Sareln: close to it
(9:39:50 AM) Tredje: That would probably be a good place to start, I think
(9:40:51 AM) Tredje: If I were to propose that the Amurites settle no further east than Odio's Prison and the Clan doesnt settle further West than OP, what would you say?
(9:41:43 AM) Sareln: I'd like one more to the right
(9:42:20 AM) Sareln: I'm kind of boxed in by the two of you, Sidar and Clan. You're sitting on a choke point it seems like, rich as well
(9:42:28 AM) Sareln: so I'd just like one more set of grassland tiles :D
(9:42:29 AM) Tredje: Would that be to grab anything in particular?
(9:43:04 AM) Sareln: yeah, It'd let me plant a coastal city to grab clams to the right/down of odio's prison
(9:43:21 AM) Sareln: and another just south of the lizard lair right next to the rice
(9:43:34 AM) Sareln: that second site is mostly to grab two flood plains.
(9:43:56 AM) Sareln: without impinging upon Iskender's grab for the pyre.
(9:45:09 AM) Sareln: I know that FP city is a touch close to your dragon-bones city, but I don't care bout the 2nd ring on that city and you'll have a good cultural headstart, so I was hoping it wouldn't be a huge issue.
(9:45:19 AM) Tredje: Let me get this straight. You propose to settle 1SW of the Rice and 1N of the Clams?
(9:45:26 AM) Sareln: no
(9:45:33 AM) Sareln: one left of the clams
(9:45:52 AM) Sareln: I think there was a hill I was trying to his just south of that lizard lair
(9:45:59 AM) Sareln: since cultural defense is so weak in this game.
(9:46:28 AM) Sareln: and one left-down from the rice.
(9:46:47 AM) Sareln: I'm using the left/right notation since I got Burned with PB in game 1 when I talked in terms of west and east btw :D
(9:47:06 AM) Sareln: there was a confusion there that caused him to not trust me for the rest of the game which helped get me killed
(9:47:43 AM) Sareln: I could probably back that northern city off another tile
(9:47:52 AM) Sareln: to be down-left of the lizard lair instead
(9:47:56 AM) Sareln: putting rice into the 2nd ring.
(9:48:03 AM) Sareln: (now that I think of it)
(9:48:08 AM) Tredje: If we were to calculate distance from the capital your Rice city would have its second ring 10 tiles east from your capital., while my second ring would be 5 tiles to the west of my capital
(9:48:19 AM) Tredje: Does that sound fair to you?
(9:49:08 AM) Sareln: nope, but do you have land to the right of your capital? I don't. I'm penned in by the sea (you can see it in the land points).
(9:49:30 AM) Sareln: so I have to push a little further left, or else I'm spread out along the edge of the continent
(9:49:39 AM) Sareln: which isn't exactly an enviable position no?
(9:50:52 AM) Tredje: I'm not sure who's position is enviable at this point. The one on the side of the map, or the person who some players are trying to box in.
(9:51:11 AM) Tredje: That being said I would be happy to try to come to some sort of arrangement.
(9:51:39 AM) Tredje: If you get to settle your Rice city, could the Clan then get the Clam city?
(9:53:53 AM) Sareln: I'd actually prefer the clam city over the rice city. If I place the city on the Odio's prison line, is that far enough away to keep both? Or is there no way for me to grab that rice? I originally placed the city in my mind wrt to food resources, if it's a huge issue I can move it off.
(9:57:39 AM) Tredje: I'm sorry, but I don't think I can accept those terms
(9:58:07 AM) Tredje: I would be willing to agree to one of those two locations, but I cannot cede both.
(10:00:14 AM) Sareln: alright, I'll take the clams city then for sure. There's going to be another Amurite city between us, let me try to place it. How does 3 left from the mountain just south of the rice sound?
(10:01:37 AM) Sareln: (on the OP line, that's one to the left of the OP)
(10:04:18 AM) Tredje: A fair offer. Would you be opposed to me taking some time to consider the deal with my coplayer?
(10:05:35 AM) Sareln: Take the time you need, I would like to hear back before 5 turns have gone by though. Tech path stuff.
(10:07:15 AM) Tredje: Of course
(10:08:20 AM) Sareln: Awesome. I would also like to consider an NAP, though feel free to sit on that until you've come to a decision on the settling agreement.
(10:08:30 AM) Sareln: great talking to you Tredje, I need breakfast now
(10:08:41 AM) Tredje: Likewise, Im going to make dinner
(10:08:44 AM) Tredje: Catch you later
(10:09:22 AM) Sareln: Ciao