EitB 0010 Wishlist/Progress

[Tasunke]

To give an example, there are only 3 unique e onimies in the game, elven forest economy, calabim population economy, and lanun sea economy.

In my mod I've already made lumber mills better with guardian of nature to help bridge the gap between fol elves and fol non elves. I've also made it to where only certain units get the extra 25% defense on ancient forests. In a perfect world this would be directly linked to religion type.

[Mardoc]

Also, I think maps would b easier to balance if everyone could choose between a land based or sea based economy. What is the most op thing about the lanun? Exclusive rights to coves, and +1 water food. I propose that everyone should have access to coves, but that it will be a choice of sorts. More details to come, but it's mostly already documented in an excel file of mine.

To give an example, there are only 3 unique e onimies in the game, elven forest economy, calabim population economy, and lanun sea economy.

In my mod I've already made lumber mills better with hidden paths to help bridge the gap between fol elves and fol non elves. I've also made it to where only certain units get the extra 25% defense on ancient forests. In a perfect world this would be directly linked to religion type.

I see your point, mostly. I worry about it taking away the special nature of FFH, though. I like the fact that elves play totally differently to Lanun, that they can coexist peacefully because they want different things. If everyone can do everything, then nothing is special.

Worse, if everyone can be the Lanun, but have their uniques on top, then there's no reason to play Lanun. Give me the choice of Calabim with seafood and coves, or Lanun with seafood and coves, and Calabim are just better. If you take away Governor's Manors and vampires, then Calabim aren't special anymore either.

I don't see where you'd stop, you might as well have only one civ in the game. Or play BtS, where the different economies are all balanced with each other already.

[superjm]

Theoretically, the Lanun should be balanced by the map itself. they really have nothing else going for them outside of water.

Also there's the Sidar wane economy, if you want to go that way (even if it's more of a souped up spec economy than anything else)

[gekko64]

If only one change was done for the Grigori in v10, it would have to be turning Cassiel back into Phi/Ind. phi/org is like starting with only one trait, as there are no org benefits early on.

Some have proposed phi/cre ... But I feel phi/ind is more thematically sound for the Grigori. (building up a world from scratch, surrounded on all sides by gods and demons)

I'd prefer phi/cre for Cassiel, Cre is very useful early on while Ind not so much due to few wonders being available earlygame. also, doesn't Sandalphon already get Phi/Ind in eitb?

[Qgqqqqq]

Ummm...what benefit do the grigori get out of IND early on?

I also cant see ANY reason why youd give everyone coves.

[HidingKneel]

Ummm...what benefit do the grigori get out of IND early on?

Getting early workers out faster?

But Phi/Ada(Cre) makes the most sense to me. I think creative fits the Grigori thematically pretty well.
It's arguably the best trait combo in the game (now that Varn got a little nerf), but I think Grigori need the boost (agnostic really hurts).

[Qgqqqqq]

Oh yeah

[Tasunke]

Sandy should probably be phi/def anyways

Lanun already get faster boats, boat capturing champions, and +1 food on water natural. With its existing flavor enhanced (ie best non magical naval warfare, combined with making the world spell non lethal) it makes the lanun everything they should be ... Ie the best at sea. Not the only at sea. Now, again, there will be a dynamic choice between land and sea economies that is directly tied to civics. If I can get unique civics working with Ffh, then the lanun's UI for the pirate kings civic (danalin's wayfarers) would be cheaper to maintain and possibly add greater distance maintenance benefits. But yea, u can choose between aristo, a plus cottages civic, and a plus coves. Civic. Republic
Is a late game civic that specifically buffs towns only. (in addition to GPP etc)

[Tasunke]

In the end, I think it ultimately makes lanun more useful/special, because everyone can now fight over the seas... Lanun are just best at it, kind of like everyone doing horse archer wars while tasunke of hippus is best at it (or hippus and kuriotates in general). Also, there is the added effect of allowing cubs starting on peninsula, or any other non river coastline, to not be fucked over. That same fear of forest chokes is what led me to move forest chops to crafting. But don't worry, wineries were moved to masonry, and crafting chops are only half as effective, and become the regular effectiveness at mining. Still get the 50% extra (of course in game terms really it's annother additive 100% which is the same as a multiplicative 50% anyhow). I think constuction would make a better tech slot for the bonus than archery. But I suppose we could leave lumber mills at archery for now. As i said earlier, mills should get either +1 commerce or +1 hammer with guardian of nature civic. Plus additional bonus at Druids tech.

[Tasunke]

Also, in my mod org dbls monument speed instead of lighthouse speed, and expansive dbls the water building that produces food (which is harbors in my mod). Meanwhile creative dbls festival n theater (no need for cre
To dbl monument). Makes sense to me as monuments are either political or spiritual, a show of power, and not generally thought of as a form of creative expression. Therefore making org monument and courthouse friendly makes the theme of the trait a focused expansion of power (a bit slower than exp or cre, but perhaps more efficient in the long term).