February 18th, 2017, 22:27
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I meant to phrase it as "not really JUST trying to win the game." 
In Soviet Russia, Civilization Micros You!
"Right, as the world goes, is only in question between equals in power, while the strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must."
“I have never understood why it is "greed" to want to keep the money you have earned but not greed to want to take somebody else's money.”
February 18th, 2017, 23:50
Bobchillingworth
Unregistered
I think Sulla's underrating the Aztecs a bit- I'd rank them as solidly top-tier; just above Germany, equal to Rome, and only slightly below Gorgo's Greeks. The Amenities bonuses are immensely useful; Aztec cities should very rarely lack for happiness, which makes sustaining long-term and/or constant wars significantly less economically painful. The Jaguar Warrior is astoundingly powerful, and their higher cost doesn't matter much if you convert enemy units to Builders and then use them to chop out Jags (although there's no way this will work quite as well against humans as the AI). Being able to rush districts can be used for some nasty tricks even with only three charges, such as quickly producing Encampments in captured cities; obviously this gets even stronger once you unlock Feudalism (which isn't *that* far down the civics tree).
I'm a little surprised nobody picked Sumeria. The War Cart is right up there with the Jag, Legion, and Phalanx, and Ziggurats might actually be useful when having to compete against superior human teching abilities.
February 22nd, 2017, 03:25
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Ive read all threads now (posted question in Sulllas thread before spoiling myself).
Can we already say that those who settled on coast messed up and are going to lose? They need to spend gold getting hills into culture - are vulnerable from sea - etc? Can they cram in an extra city to mitigate the loss?
Howver it seems teh has similar expansion plans as sullla so I suppose we have the two contenders there.
February 22nd, 2017, 06:21
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I agree the right move was to move the capital off the coast due to some seemingly obvious reasons as people have already pointed out (faster/better access to production tiles, fewer trash water tiles, less vulnerable to sea attack, etc).
That said, if Sulla settled on the coast and everyone else settled in the more optimal position inland, would you then tell me he wasn't favourite to win this game?
I don't think it will be the one deciding factor to who wins. It just doesn't feel me with confidence that someone making that particular decision has the strategical prowess to overcome a veteran such as Sulla. Happy to be proven wrong.
February 23rd, 2017, 06:06
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(February 22nd, 2017, 06:21)seifer_md Wrote: That said, if Sulla settled on the coast and everyone else settled in the more optimal position inland, would you then tell me he wasn't favourite to win this game?
I don't think it will be the one deciding factor to who wins. It just doesn't feel me with confidence that someone making that particular decision has the strategical prowess to overcome a veteran such as Sulla. Happy to be proven wrong.
These small things matters when opponents are on same level in terms of tactics & strategy and I doubt this is the case 
February 23rd, 2017, 07:16
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Glad to see this happening here! Finally a Civ6 game, although seeing how prepared Sullla is going into this, it might become a lopsided affair. Can't wait to see his rush play out.
My instinct would have been to settle off the coast as well, but then TheArchduke was happy about settling in place, because it opened up more settling spots for him. Maybe on a map this cramped a city or two more, especially as Rome can make a difference? I look forward to finding out!
February 23rd, 2017, 15:19
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Unaghy, you might be posting a little too much specific advice/criticism in players threads for a spoiled lurker. For example settling on the coast or no - they already did settle capital and cant take that back, but they will likely found future cities inland, possibly because of comments.
I think general lurkers are expected to let players live mistakes, and comments and questions limited to "tough luck there" and "how is going/got a screenshot".
Dedicated lurkers can and should provide advice and critical/rhetorical questions like " do you really think a knight rush is gonna work T 150...?"
That is my understanding, maybe other more experienced lurkers can clarify.
Apart from that, going to be interesting to see this play out. I think the coast-settlers did so out civ4 mindset...which means they probably arent civsixperienced enough to do anything with their misplant besides suffer more and more from it.
Im also interested in Sulllas upcoming C&D post - what can be gleaned from score and demographics in this game.
I tentatively predict a sullla win, teh is wild card. However, if A. people can realize there is runaway in the game and B. they decide to act and C. if it is possible for 2-3 lesser civs to stop a runaway in civ6, then anything can happen.
February 23rd, 2017, 16:58
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(February 23rd, 2017, 15:19)Molach Wrote: I think general lurkers are expected to let players live mistakes, and comments and questions limited to "tough luck there" and "how is going/got a screenshot".
Dedicated lurkers can and should provide advice and critical/rhetorical questions like " do you really think a knight rush is gonna work T 150...?"
That is my understanding, maybe other more experienced lurkers can clarify.
This is generally the way we roll, but we do tend to make exceptions for games that aren't being taken super seriously for whatever reason. I think 'no one really knows the best way to play Civ6' is a fair exception. Unaghy is sticking to decisions already made, rather than making concrete suggestions or passing spoilers, so I don't think I'd object in his case.
Alternately, if we were to be strict about the lurker code, then half+ the discussion in Sullla's thread is also out of bounds. It's true that Sullla has spent more time thinking about the best ways to play Civ6 than most of the lurkers, but discussion that forces him to clarify/explain his thinking can only help him. Besides, he might have something wrong  .
In this particular case, I think learning about Civ6 and building enthusiasm both are good reasons to be less strict than usual about lurker code. Still shouldn't pass on spoilers, but no one is toeing that line yet.
EitB 25 - Perpentach
Occasional mapmaker
February 23rd, 2017, 23:40
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teh can now blame mr. patch if he loses. So he cannot lose. 
February 24th, 2017, 01:43
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What was the rationale with the harbor change. Was there really an issue with the extra trade route to offset crappy water tiles?
In Soviet Russia, Civilization Micros You!
"Right, as the world goes, is only in question between equals in power, while the strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must."
“I have never understood why it is "greed" to want to keep the money you have earned but not greed to want to take somebody else's money.”
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