[PB66 Mjmd] I HAVE NOT YET BEGUN TO FIGHT!!!

[Mjmd]

Storm

Sorry for the delay in reporting. There were multiple reasons.....



252

So I had a vague inkling that I should put units in my capital after he nuked, but I didn't........ So the question is how did Plemo KNOW I didn't; it is beyond bomber scout range (future Mjmd I think I figured out). It was a hell of a bet to use a GG on and TWO tactical nukes. I'm pretty sure tile marked was where they hit as that is where event log is taking, me but improvements are still there??? Small mystery.



So he sent me a cease fire, which I ALMOST took as I could go back to war in my time frame (like 3 turns lol) and then a peace treaty.

Why keep turning down treaties you may ask. Didn't I say recently in my thread in real time that I would peace out even without Captain Morgan if I had to. WELL it turns out terror bombing doesn't weaken an enemies moral WHO KNEW. If only there was history on this Plemo could have learned from..... Anyways, now I'm bound and determined to get Captain Morgan back.

He did poke at the city down south I thought might be razed, but evidently didn't have forces at the time.

Forgot to build culture in Yankee Brown last turn to retake tiles from T/C to make itself safe. I can't imagine Plemo wants to spend the forces on a size 1 city, but might as well be safe.

I got fish for fish from T/C. Sent them a request to CLOSE THEIR BLOODY BORDERS to Plemo. If Plemo gives me Captain Morgan back I will feel 0 sympathy about letting Plemo win this.

Its at this point in my thought process I resent Plemo my peace offer some 10 times. Listen eventually Gav is coming in vs you Plemo. He may be taking his sweet time, but its coming. I don't particularly want to help anyone atm, so MAKE PEACE so I can just sit around!

That being said, have I mentioned Gav reopened open borders with Plemo for some unknown reason........ What is wrong with you people! I have scouts trying to make sure Plemo doesn't invade me from old Amica land, but still......

I'm also not out of war potential. I have 14 cities coming online still. Sure 3 of those are ones that were razed recently, but with cereal mills they come online pretty fast. Sure I can't tech worth a damn now, but that just gives me more incentive to end this fast. I am pretty sure Plemo's power graph is rising faster than mine. We are BASICALLY tied this turn, which is somewhat surprising considering I nuked a bunch of his stuff just last turn.

I also of course have plans to just take Captain Morgan if need be. It isn't THAT hard. I just need more nukes! I have the 3 whips lined up for next turn, but ya you can see why I was tempted to take that cease fire. I have no more plans for 3 more turns. I do regret using those two nukes on the junk city last turn, but ah well.

I did make the decision to switch away from navy again. I just don't think I'll need much. Plemo can't really force the straights.

BTW making a prediction that T/C spread cereal mills in a few cities now that I no longer have the headquarters (few cities mind not all, it is expensive after all).

T253

Plemo whipped a lot last turn and passed me in soldiers. I've moved entirely off fleet production atm until shown otherwise.

Moving up an impi paying off. AND ya let me do some fighter counting.



Instead of evacuating the two infantry at my new straight city he bombed me and then attacked going 1-1 in infantry battles (his bombing dropped marines too low). Also, I haven't put random old two movers up here....... I airlifted a chariot in to fix the problem! But ya had to use tanks for now.



MAYBE T/C put a railroad on that hill to help me. MAYBE. I suspect they are just trying to help us kill each other. I SPECIFICALLY put a city defense infantry there to signal to NOT do that. One of us has been peaceful all game and giving them cities. The other took cities in their sphere of influence and dared them to do anything about them..... And yet I can't even get them to not build a bloody railroad. They of course didn't cancel open borders.

Anyways took out my frustration by going 6-2 in fighters in isthmus area. Now some of you may go BUT Mjmd there were 8 fighters? Well yes, but 2 of them weren't covering some of the same tiles so I was able to isolate to take just the other 6. I actually haven't been producing a lot of fighters recently, just one every two turns out of one city and a lot of mine are healing still, so very happy got another round of good luck. Only 1 of those kills was a cleanup kill too. Also note that not a lot of mine got damaged winning, which is also important.

Got another GG. Thinking of settling for military production...... You know for some ICBM action!

Moving a lot of units around. Don't want sudden movement next turn to be weird. Also, if he focuses south instead of middle so be it.

Whipping 3 tactical nukes freed up a lot of military police to go elsewhere.

[Qgqqqqq]

What's the cost benefit for you in spreading cereal mills without the HQ?

[Miguelito]

refounded cities come without whip anger so, net positive?

[Mjmd]

I'm impi so with UB costs aren't TOO bad........  That being said my capital was yes the HQ, with Wall Street, with Oxford. It was 1/5 of my research BEFORE I started "industrializing" my towns. I never did check how much of my gpt it was, but looking at pictures I went from 817gpt to 490gpt. Suffice it to say I went from lowest GNP in the game to crawling by comparison GNP.

@Mig EXACTLY!!!! Kidding aside a newly founded city with cereal mills takes about 20 turns to get up and running as a production only city. Which isn't too bad really, but it isn't nothing. Your cities I captured are JUST starting to come online.

[Miguelito]

as long as strike's avoided, the economy fulfils its purpose right?

[Mjmd]

Know T/C posted so lets try to get caught up.

Banks of the Sacramento



T254

T/C did give me the beaver I lost....... So that is something from them.

Gav went into a late game golden age. He might have game on wrap if something doesn't happen. Stupid T/C I really wanted them to help me defeat Plemo so I could war Gav and let them win. Not war in a serious way mind, but just in an annoying raze a few cities way. But NOOO T/C have been fence sitting. Meanwhile Gav is promising me help so I can't attack him and he is doing late game golden ages. PHAH.



I can't figure out why he switched to Buddhism though..... I'm sure there is a reason, but it seems late for monk temples, but I'll assume there is a reason I'm just missing because I'm spending enough brain power on the war.

Speaking of things I can't figure out. What plan Plemo was trying to do again????....... He mentioned in tech thread that he did something wrong and wasn't sure if he was going to make a move, but I have no clue what that move was. I'm sure nothing bad will happen next turn at all.......... (note last time I couldn't figure it out my capital was razed). There are a few ships in the upper part of the peninsula, but nothing too scary. I would expect retaking this may be a priority for him.

I'm also curious what specialist Gav is trying to get with caste plus pacifism. Unless he is trying for a super late culture push??? Maybe a scientist for Aluminum co???

Oh what that you say the picture above conveniently shows fighters I'm counting??? So I count 9 fighters, but with the farm SW of horse and rd diagonal of my peninsula city I can isolate 6 of them, so lets do that?

PHAH went 6-5 and lost a couple of highly promoted ones at that. Couldn't even get the last fighter I was trying to isolate. When they become super damaged they have a lower incept rate I believe so I actually ended up destroying some improvements that I didn't want to. And yes I accidentally bombed a wrong tile so I got one of the back 3 stack but one of the forward ones is still alive albeit super injured. I even sent in a bomber to try to finish it off (tested in worldbuilder and it is possible). I had 3 bombers left but no tile that was safe to bomb they could hit that only that 1 fighter covered. Now I could have roaded tile farm was on, but again, there isn't even a guarantee the fighter intercept would trigger. This is also where I regret not building more fighters.

I also finally noticed my capital was moved to Fire and Flame (IE Jacks old cap) when I built an academy with gg. This is also the location of forbidden palace........... AWKWARD and also partly explains my horrible finances although loss of corp headquarters and my best city is probably more to blame.

Only other action this turn was killing a bomber in gavs capital with a chariot! Assuming it was there as a scout, but seems like an expensive scout (explorer would be actual unit). Future Mjmd. I was posting T252 and I realized THIS might be how he knew capital was still empty.

T255

Some diplo at start. Plemo warned me of Gav winning by sending peace treaty with 2 of my cities on his border. What do I care Plemo? I'm not winning, but yes I plan on getting a peace treaty.....

Gav re-promised me help in 5 turns. So if Plemo doesn't take my peace treaty he is doomed. Plemo is also leaving a lot of his infantry on Gav border all in a city on Gavs border...... WHY?!?! Even if Gav only has cannons its bad idea, but he has nukes too.

On to the turn. Up north I knew a Plemo city at min distance would retake key tiles, but doing a 3 ring city in one turn is quite the feat. Both corps and culture build quite a thing. I can pillage the railroads, but probably have to vacate the two planes in the forts if nothing else.



Down south he evacuated Captain Morgan. Completely. Is this signaling he wants peace? Well I may as well go through with my plan still because I need a little revenge for my capital anyways.

First some late night bombing where he had a fighter super far back I didn't know about. Also on near fort tried bombing but forgot about sam I should have looked for. Decided it wasn't worth sacrificing a fighter, sooooo



(there were some very highly promoted infantry there too so doubt bombers would have done enough). Nuke softened up and in came some tanks and also a random rifle to finish off. Next two tanks to clear 2/3 of the stack, and then GUIDED MISSLES to kill last one.

AND FINALLY Magics old capital......



With having bombed it ahead of time only 1 nuke required. I actually did build more bombers but I realized a turn late I would want them, so ya at least 1 nuke this turn probably could have been avoided if I had realized sooner / my fights could have gone better.

BUT BLOODY HELL. I LOST SOOO MANY 70%+ fights this turn cleaning up his units.



SOOO because city was empty this whole thing took less nukes than I thought it would........ What do we think is in those two galleons?



Was it worth the use of two tactical nukes? PROBABLY NOT? But it felt good. Technically its about even hammers,  but two tactical nukes are much harder for me to build. I am worried about counter attack, so maybe I got something? Plemo does still have quite a few transports down there though.

Note I renamed Sacremento to Out on Holiday in honor of the razed city and moved Sacramento across the way.

Decided to tighten the screws for peace and sent in the fleet! Risky, but I think Plemo has also been skimping on fleet production.



Since I came into this turn with a pretty definite plan I had forgotten to scout Gav territory (also he had sent me offer to help so wasn't as worried). Discovered 2 sets of 2 workers NW 7-9 tiles of Gavs capital. When deciding which to kill accidentally miss clicked. Ah well. I am curious...... Also glad those workers aren't at home.

So I had assumed I was #2 in power to Plemo as usual, but I'm actually #2 in power to T/C....... What is all the military for eh?

[Mjmd]

Sailing Down to Gary



T256

VICTORY!!!! - IE I got peace. I got all my war aims, but at a high cost in cities and time (both in actual turns and actual real time). A pyrrhic victory. 

Turn started out with a bunch of offers from Plemo for resources. Took the two grains for 1 iron. Denied the 1 for 1s that followed.

He also wants help vs Gav. Gav tried to get me to sign a defensive pact. NICE TRY SUCKERS I'M OUTTA HERE!!!! Sent everyone fish for fish.

So ya if a city is unhealthy lets look at harbors and grocers. If its unhappy still (yes even without WW I have some of these), lets put some markets in.

Sent Plemo a request for wheat, stone, and 3gpt for a gold. Yes on what was supposed to be a non random map I still don't have stone with 1/4 of the worlds territory.

So ya was going to do a look back on war, but then between my original 15 min playing and finally getting around to properly playing Plemo invaded Gav. LOL.

Was this pre planned? Like he did leave Captain Morgan empty last turn. Anyways, he took or razed 7 Gav cities! Which does seem to indicate some pre planning to have those forces in position.

Do I feel bad. NO, no I don't. I know Gav has nukes he could have used at any time to help me and ambush Plemo with. He has also been skirting by with an embarrassing power while Plemo and I have been chucking forces at each other.

Anyways, Gav is huddling up in his cities waiting to be nuked. Also, I've been meaning to mention this but Plemo moved his capital at some point this game and I've been confused about it........



So the big question of course is "will T/C finally do something". They are tech lead and power lead. I was originally confused by fur cancellation, but then figured out it meant they just finally teched plastics. They also have satelites so they are close to unlocking next gen of military tech. I'm finally going to get tech vision of them for reporting purposes.

Plemo offered me fish for fish until T350. IE end of game. Kind of like how I offered to other two players earlier. Will I interfere? PROBABLY not. I would just be king making at this point. I've probably done too much already. Not that there aren't annoying cities I wouldn't mind destroying (see all foreign cities in below picture), but still not in the plans.



Also, I like looking at my fleet......

So how much do I help others? What kind of trades should I make. So far I've done a couple with Plemo that are 2 - 1 which as I can't win probably is still a good deal for him. I even got a rice from him which I don't know if it was an accident from him or not. Do I open borders with Plemo? Would help my trade route income, but also help his. Again, mine probably doesn't matter. Maybe for gpt? Was going to send him a request for open border and 30gpt and included a fish for fish. Rethought and for fun sent for 50gpt, will see if he negotiates down. I'm implying you can pay me for peace here.

So ya doing a late game infrastructure push because? So gold buildings first, then a round of librarys. Trying to rebuild Oxford, but I think wall street is just too expensive. Took a bunch of engineers off to actually work sea tiles. Not a particularly valuable tile at war, but try to get next gen of military to stay relevant at least.

For some reason I'm paranoid about T/C attacking me....... But that would be insane right? Still there are a couple suspicious subs.

And another login this turn to Plemo sending back the 50gpt!!!! Also T/C sent back for fish for fish. Ya I'm just ending this turn with tons of units left to move. Wait, morning brain is actually working. Put banks in over grocers, who cares about some unhealthy. Also switched most markets to banks. I now have spare military to "make people happy" right? 



Yes that is 22/53 cities on banks. Ignore all the granaries in cities that were razed and now being rebuilt. 

Anyways. I'll have some follow up thoughts on war. Let me know if ya'll have questions. I'll post what is hopefully final kill / death numbers whenever I get around to retrospective. I will try to report Gav action as I'm not sure how much Plemo is / for US crowd in either case as Gav probably won't.

[Qgqqqqq]

I think most of my questions are about the war and your reflections.

Would you do it all over again?

How do you rate everyone's chances? What are your tech goals (what is the next generation of military tech)? What do you want out of the rest of this game?

[Mjmd]

Guys, I will need more time, as I will have to put lots of thought into this turn - even more than I expected. Also, I am not sure if I need to as I agree to the draw offer mjmd earlier extended. If anyone else wants to play for victory, I will continue of course.

  I find this funny as obviously he was very gung ho on continuing when he didn't have to do anything. 

My interpretation, "heh Mjmd isn't doing all the work anymore maybe I don't want to bare the full force over here / I know T/C will win if they play it right". 

Although honestly I could just see a balance of power 3 way going on for a while. One of them starts gaining an edge other two jump in until that person is lower then it switches who the 2v1 is against.

[Mjmd]

I hadn't renamed some of Migs yet, so this was actually last song atm.

Mackinaw



So would I do the war over again. YES. Plemo was very clearly winning and not only was he winning but he had some very good forward cities threatening me. I will note he technically declared on me T223, but that was only a turn or so before I was going to declare on him, but ya a nice 33 turns of modern warfare. Anyways, I couldn't do anything until I took care of this. I can't stress how strategically valuable this sea and straight were. I've noted where key former Plemo cities were.



Again, I think some people will forget this game that Plemo had such a forward presence. I also managed to knock him from 46 cities to 39 with 3 of those being recently refounded. T/C of course also got 4 cities from my efforts. AND we won't talk about the cost to me. Still, I'm rather proud of the campaign. It was long and grueling with tons of little decisions. But I executed my strategy of pushing Plemo from west to east and then south. I never got my stacks nuked, which took a lot of time to try micro let me tell you. There are obviously things I wish I had done differently, but for my first foray into modern military in civ4 it was both fun (mostly) and interesting. I also was proud I didn't crack under the losses. Mjmd of a couple years ago could not have been able to play this game. I will note it also helps to name your thread something where you literally can't give up or you are going against it.

I was hoping that like the Americans in our revolution an ally or two would step in. Or like happened to Captain Jones that someone would throw a key grenade into the combat. When we read history its often told as a "this person or country did this thing" and then it never mentions all the help they got doing the thing. No one remembers the biggest action of the American Revolution was arguably the siege of Gibraltar.........

Final kill numbers.


 
If people want it sorted on built I can log back in, but basically you aren't seeing the very 1 sided deaths of my marines and tanks. I do like how the fighter numbers had gotten to over 30 in my favor. 

Any questions while I still remember fighting this beast?