RBP3 [SPOILERS] - Friendly Kittens (Ragnar of Maya)

[Maniac Marshall]

Ref, Civstats says we already did our turn. Right? Don't want someone else outside team moving for us...

[Cull]

Thanks Maniac, and doubtful of Turn 3 Barbs, or for that matter any turn before 10 barbs. Then again, I have never played on Emperor.

[RefSteel]

Yeah; sorry I didn't make that clearer. I saw we all agreed on moving SW, so I did so, took some screenies, ended turn, and posted here (see the latest image upthread). The new S or SW question is for turn 3 (confusingly, the fourth turn we'll actually play, since we start with turn 0) - moving from Yalara's position in the latest screenie (or that you'll see if you log into the game!) - onto a floodplains mostly shielded by river or a grassland that reveals more of the fog. Either one reveals the jungle tile, but no, I don't REALLY expect to see gems or gold underneath!

On barbs: In my Emperor sandbox game, my warrior was attacked by wolves as early as turn 7. I'm trying to run some sims up to ~T40 right now (though remember: No battle plan survives contact with the [strike]enemy[/strike] happy, friendly possible ally) but I'll try and check on barb chances too, hopefully this evening. There's also probably something on the subject at CivFanatics someplace.

[Cull]

We need to scout , as shown in rbp1 where meeting quickly means a better chance of a long-time ally. I saw move 1sw to reveal more titles. Also, barb animals of t7! After worker build, I say go warrior,warrior/settler, warrior/settler(depending on which goes first), worker.

[RefSteel]

We need to scout , as shown in rbp1 where meeting quickly means a better chance of a long-time ally. I saw move 1sw to reveal more titles. Also, barb animals of t7! After worker build, I say go warrior,warrior/settler, warrior/settler(depending on which goes first), worker.

Looks like we all agree on moving SW. Also, I agree (at least to a point) with the importance of scouting ... which is part of the reason one build order I'm considering right now (after worker) is Warrior - Warrior - Warrior - Worker - Settler! Note I said ONE of the options; not necessarily the best. I'll get a full analysis up when I've finished simming things. Also, once BW comes in, our build queue might get very complicated in a hurry.

[RefSteel]

Turn 3 played - (meaning our fourth move was made) - SW as planned.

And there's good news! (I think it's good news, anyway!)



We've got grassland cattle a couple tiles west of the floodplains!

So, who wants to bet on which as-yet-hidden strategic resource is covered by that one-tile jungle?

(Kidding.)

(I think.)

My Plan of Exploration as posted above called for our next move to be 1SE, but I now prefer 1S onto the jungle, and I can see the argument for 1SW, even though it takes us further away from the Black Dots™. In any case, we should start swinging back east soon though, in my opinion.

[RefSteel]

Okay, screenie and report from the latest turn is one post upthread. But I've been looking at development plans for our city too, and I thought I'd post 'em here. Beware: Wall O' Micromanagement Text ahead!

Okay, I ran a bunch of sims, and I think our tech path has to be Agriculture > Animal Husbandry > Bronze Working. There's just no excuse not to improve those two food tiles ASAP. More importantly, we can get a settler out (with two chops) on turn 42, with Fierias at size 4 working all improved tiles, plus 2 workers, 4 warriors (minus any who've been eaten) and a bit of leeway in terms of worker turns (e.g. in case of forest or [shudder] jungle growth in the wrong spot) and another worker due in ~4 turns. Here's what I've got:

Option 1: This is the first plan I came up with (the first one I simmed out) and I still think it's - almost - as good as we can get.

T5: Borders pop. Fierias works sheep.
T11: Agri hits. Start Animal Husbandry.
T15: Worker complete; start Warrior. Worker moves to corn and farms. Fierias works corn.
T19: Farm complete.
T20: Worker moves 1W to the grassland hill.
T21: Fieras grows to size 2, works corn+sheep. Worker mines.
T24: Mine complete. Fierias works corn+mine.
T25: AH hits; choose Bronze Working. Warrior2 complete; start Warrior. Worker moves 1W to sheep and pastures. Fierias works corn+(unimproved)sheep.
T26: Fieras grows to size 3, works corn+sheep+mine.
T28: Pasture complete.
T29: Warrior3 complete. Start Warrior. Worker moves 1E onto mine.
T30: Worker moves 1E-1NE to grass hill.
T31: Fierias grows to size 4, works corn+sheep+mine+grass forest. Worker mines.
T32: Warrior4 complete; start Worker. Fierias works corn+sheep+mine+river grassland!
T34: Mine complete. Fierias works corn+sheep+mine+mine
T35: Worker moves 1S to river plains tile and farms.
T36: Worker puts a second turn into a farm, but his orders are then CANCELED!
T37: Worker2 complete; start Settler. Worker1 moves 1S into a river grass forest; Worker2 moves 1SW into a different river grass forest.
T38: BW hits! Tech choice TBD based on game situation. Both Workers chop.
T40: Both chops complete.
T41: Worker moves TBD based on game situation.
T42: Settler complete. 10h overflow, 6f in box, 60b of research (not counting prereq bonuses if any) toward our next tech.


Option 2: This completes our first warrior build one turn sooner, with more hammers invested earlier (meaning we can finish it sooner in an emergency) and the net cost by the time we reach turn 42 is just 4 food if all goes as planned. I think this is now my preferred option.

T5: Borders pop. Fierias works sheep.
T11: Agri hits. Start Animal Husbandry.
T15: Worker complete; start Warrior. Worker moves to corn and farms. Fierias works plains forest.
T16: Fierias works sheep.
T19: Farm complete. Fierias works corn.
T20: Worker moves 1W to the grassland hill.
T21: Worker mines.
T22: Fieras grows to size 2, works corn+sheep.
T24: Warrior2 complete; start Warrior. Mine complete. Fierias works corn+mine.
T25: AH hits; choose Bronze Working. Worker moves 1W to sheep and pastures. Fierias works corn+(unimproved)sheep.
T27: Fieras grows to size 3, works corn+sheep+mine.
T28: Pasture complete.
T29: Warrior3 complete. Start Warrior. Worker moves 1E onto mine.
T30: Worker moves 1E-1NE to grass hill.
T32: Warrior4 complete; start Worker. Fierias grows to size 4, works corn+sheep+mine+river grassland. Worker mines.
T34: Mine complete. Fierias works corn+sheep+mine+mine
T35: Worker moves 1S to river plains and farms.
T36: Worker puts a second turn into a farm, but his orders are then CANCELED!
T37: Worker2 complete; start Settler. Worker1 moves 1S into a river grass forest; Worker2 moves 1SW into a different river grass forest.
T38: BW hits! Tech choice TBD based on game situation. Both Workers chop.
T40: Both chops complete.
T41: Worker moves TBD based on game situation.
T42: Settler complete. 10h overflow, 2f in box, 60b of research (not counting prereq bonuses if any) toward our next tech.


Option 3: This is clearly the worst option overall, but gets the Warrior fastest, and only delays the settler by 1 turn. I wouldn't plan for this one, but if a belligerent neighbor shows up at the wrong time and place, this (or even something slightly more extreme) might be necessary.
T5: Borders pop. Fierias works sheep.
T11: Agri hits. Start Animal Husbandry.
T15: Worker complete; start Warrior. Worker moves to corn and farms. Fierias works plains forest.
T19: Farm complete. Fierias works corn.
T20: Worker moves 1W to the grassland hill.
T21: Warrior2 complete; start Warrior. Worker mines.
T23: Fieras grows to size 2, works corn+sheep.
T24: Mine complete. Fierias works corn+mine.
T25: AH hits; choose Bronze Working. Worker moves 1W to sheep and pastures.
T27: Warrior3 complete; start Warrior. Fierias works corn+(unimproved)sheep.
T28: Fieras grows to size 3, works corn+sheep+mine. Pasture complete.
T29: Worker moves 1E onto mine.
T30: Worker moves 1E-1NE to grass hill.
T31: Warrior4 complete; start Barracks. Worker mines.
T33: Fierias grows to size 4, works corn+sheep+mine+grass forest. Start Worker (Barracks on hold).
T34: Mine complete. Fierias works corn+sheep+mine+mine.
T35: Worker moves 1S to river plains and farms.
T36: Worker moves 1SE-S to a grass hill.
T37: Worker mines for a turn, but the order is then immediately CANCELED!
T38: Worker2 complete; start Settler (Barracks still on hold). Worker1 moves 1NW into a river grass forest; Worker2 moves 1SW into a different river grass forest.
T39: BW hits! Tech choice TBD based on game situation. Both Workers chop.
T41: Both chops complete.
T42: Worker moves TBD based on game situation.
T43: Settler complete. 9h overflow, 4f in box, 68b of research (not counting prereq bonuses if any) toward our next tech. Note this is one turn LATER than the first two options.


Note that we CAN get a settler out sooner than this, but I think it hurts our capital's development too much if we do so. We could also wait longer on a settler and grow our capital to size 5 (there are more grass river hills we can mine) but that option didn't look attractive to me either. We need to balance vertical and horizontal growth, and getting our first settler out shortly after Bronze comes in (with AH already in the bag) seems to me like a good idea. We won't be the first team to two cities (this start would be so strong for Expansive India, it almost looks tailored for the purpose, so if all the starts look something like this, that team of four(!) top players is just going to be insane...) but we won't be doing too badly. Remember that this game is on a higher difficulty than any of our previous Pitboss games, so research will be slower (and barbs thornier) across the board.

What do you think?

[RefSteel]

Annnnnnd a triple-post for laughs.

I mentioned that we won't be spending much time on C&D, but we did notice that Morgan's team moved twice before founding a city. I can't wait to see the river-grass-corn + river-grass-pigs + coastal-fish capital they got, outwitting the mapmakers by settling ON their jungle silver! (Yes, I'm kidding, but their capital must be seriously great.)

[Maniac Marshall]

Annnnnnd a triple-post for laughs.

I mentioned that we won't be spending much time on C&D, but we did notice that Morgan's team moved twice before founding a city. I can't wait to see the river-grass-corn + river-grass-pigs + coastal-fish capital they got, outwitting the mapmakers by settling ON their jungle silver! (Yes, I'm kidding, but their capital must be seriously great.)

[Cull]

Option 2 is prefered and Yalara should keeping going west, until meeting another civ, so 1sw IMO. If needed we can bring him back after meeting another civ, or use another warrior to scout. That would prov risky for barbs just entering capital. I would take the risk