RBP3 [SPOILERS] - Friendly Kittens (Ragnar of Maya)

[Maniac Marshall]

Well, Turn 87 got off to a great start when my gf decided that right when I was moving a chariot was a great time to give me a hug... This caused me to misclick the chariot badly, for which I was VERY pissed. The only way to make sure we don't lose Feng Shui now is to have a turn of unhappyness. It's not worth revolting to monarchy for, we'll just lose a turn working a cottage, which really sucks, but it could be worse.

[Maniac Marshall]

Turn 88
--------
Fierias grows to size 6, builds Forge (axe on hold) works Sheep, Corn, Silver, Farm, 2 mines
Pride Rock grows to size 6, builds Forge (axe on hold) Works Cows, Horses, Farm, Shared Cottage 2 mines
Temminck grows to size 5, builds Archer, Works Rice, Copper, Gold, 2 cottages.
Feng Shui builds Garinery, Works Farm
Kilrah founded, starts Library, works Pigs
Berlioz Roads
Dutchess moves 1SE to a hill
Toulouse and Chimeee clear jungle off the Dyes (complete)
Thomas O'Malley and Oliver Mine (complete)
Marie Mines

Turn 89
--------
Fieras builds Forge (axe on hold) works Sheep, Corn, Silver, Farm, 2 mines
Pride builds Forge (axe on hold), Works Cows, Horses, Shared Cottage and 3 mines!
Temminck builds Archer, Works Works Rice, Copper, Gold, 2 cottages.
Feng Shui builds grainery, works Farm
Kilrah builds Library, works Pigs
Berlioz Roads (complete)
Dutchess Roads
Toulouse and Chimee Plantation the Dyes.
Thomas O'Malley and Oliver Move S-SE to a riverside grassland.
Oliver move SW-W to a plains forest
Marie Mines (complete)

Turn 90
--------
Fieras builds Forge (axe on hold) Works Sheep, Corn, Silver S Cottage, 2 Mines
Pride Rock builds Forge (aze on hold) works Cows, Horses, Plains Forest and 3 Mines (yes, this starves the city for a turn
Temminck builds Worker, works Rice, Copper, Gold, 2 Cottages
Feng Shui whips library, works Farm
Kilrah builds Library, Works Pigs
Berlioz moves to the pigs
Dutchess roads (complete)
Toulouse and Chimee Plantation the Dyes.
Thomas and Oliver Farms.
Marie joins thomas/oliver and, farms


Turn 91
--------
Fierias tripple whips forge, works Sheep, Corn, SW cottage, Silver.
Pride Rock double whipps forge, works Cows, Farm, new grass farm, shared cottage.
Temminck builds Worker, works Rice, Copper, Gold, 2 Cottages
Feng Shui builds grainery, works farm
Kilrah works pigs, builds library
Berlioz roads the pigs
Dutchess moves N-NE, chops, and cancels
Chimeee Plantations (Complete)
Toulouse moves S-S to a gems hill
Thomas and Marie Farm (Complete)
Oliver moves W-W-NW to a plains forest

Turn 92
--------
Fierias completes forge, starts catapult, works Sheep, Corn, Silver, SW Cottage
Pride Rock grows to size 5, builds archer, Works Cows, Horses, Farm, Shared Cottage, Grass Mine
Temminck builds Worker, works Rice, Copper, Gold, 2 Cottages
Feng Shui builds grainery, works farm
Kilrah works pigs, builds library
Berlioz Roads (complete)
Dutchess moves to the pigs and pastures.
Chimeee moves S and roads
Toulouse roads
Thomas and Marie Road
Oliver Chops

Turn 93
--------
Currency recieved, research BACK ON!
Fierias grows to size 5, builds catapult, works Corn, Sheep, Silver, S Cottage, SW Cottage
Pride Rock builds archer, works Cows, Horses, Farm, Shared Cottage, Grass Mine
Temminck builds worker, works Rice, Copper, Gold, 2 Cottages
Feng Shui builds grainery, works farm
Kilrah works pigs, builds library
Berlioz and Dutchess Pasture
Chimeee roads (Complete)
Toulouse roads (Complete)
Thomas and Marie move SE-E and road
Oliver chops

Turn 94
--------
Fierias builds catapult, works Corn, Sheep, Silver, S Cottage, SW Cottage
Pride Rock Finishes Archer, starts Stable, works Cows, horses, Farm, Shared Cottage, Grass Cottage.
Temminck builds worker, works Rice, Copper, Gold, 2 Cottages
Feng Shui builds grainery, works farm
Kilrah works pigs, builds library
Berlioz Pastures (Complete)
Dutchess moves NW, SW and chops
Chimeee moves to the gems and chops
Toulouse chops
Thomas and Marie move to the dyes and road.
Oliver chops (complete)

[Cull]

Chat with Carthage
--------
me: Hey, question for you.
9:16 PM
Can't do it right now, this would be an idea for maybe 10-15 turns from now.
9:17 PM
Would you be interested in exchanging a couple of thse Numidians for a couple regular HA's?

Pacal: we could certainly be interested, yes

I'm not sure on the exact time line
9:18 PM
we've already been approached by England with an almost identical offer so it would have to be after that

me: Thats fine, i'm just thinking generally
9:19 PM
Pacal: but there is certainly room for more than one such deal in the long run

me: well, in 7-8 turns, we should be able to virtually make a Stable/Barracks HA every other turn at one city
9:20 PM
Pacal: we should get to that point somewhat soon, although not quite that quickly

the other consideration too is how quickly guilds will come
9:21 PM
no real point producing NCs and HAs to trade when they will be obsolete shortly thereafter
9:23 PM
me: We're getting those uber ponies from Byz when THEY get Guilds eventually. I dono why they joined the other alliance when they have so many deals with us and Kyan. Wonder what India offered them.

Pacal: I can't understand it either

diplo wise, they haven't gotten along with some of PAT

me: Well, the rate tech is flying in this game everything will be obsolete soon

Pacal: but in game wise, it doesn't make any sense to me at all

well, hopefully the tech rate will only be flying for one alliance
9:24 PM
me: i worry about their production advantage.

Pacal: agreed
9:25 PM
although it is a 6v8, one of those 8 is Azteca

me: and another is JANK

Pacal: Jank is inca?

me: yeah

Pacal: ok, don't have contact with them, so wasn't sure of their team name

me: between them they make a civ
9:26 PM
Pacal: lol, or less

me: they are the mexican apple thieves officially

Pacal: last I checked, Aztec was still at two cities

although that was admittedly a while ago

me: but thier eimai is JANK I think
9:27 PM
Thats the only team I havent met

ru

Pacal: Inca and Rome are the only ones for us

me: Ruff showed up at my boarders last turn. Worried me a bit

He showed up right next to a settler

Pacal: that's unlucky
9:28 PM
me: his archer was wounded
9:29 PM
we took the risk to move to the city site anyway and hope we wouldnt try to kill the chariot. Fortunately he moved away

Pacal: nice
9:30 PM
me: That city wouldn't have killed us to lose, unlike the misclick 4 happyness one from last night

that would be a killer

Pacal: I need to go have dinner shortly
9:31 PM
let's work out the details later, but we would certainly be interested in pursuing NCs for HAs

me: enjoy!

Pacal: cya

me: no rush, c ya
-------

Trading HAs for NCs sounds good, but what would be the exchange? 1 for 1, or 1 NC for 1.5 HAs? Need to iron that out.

I'm updating my first post in the thread to update the whole alliance structure as I see it, and our relations with each civ.

[Maniac Marshall]

Never fear, MM. There are lurkers enjoying your posting efforts! I'm actively lurking all threads for this game, but that spoils me from doing anything other than posting general messages. I wish you luck in steering the game towards one where there are multiple, smaller alliances instead of two monster alliances going head-to-head.

I bet Reagan thinks we forgot all about him, but no... I've just been waiting for a special unit... We've already named 2 units snowball, and, well, by revisionist history, we've already named FIVE units Snowball...

WTF am I talking about you ask? Well, you see, I forgot to get a picture the first time before Snowball IV dissappeared, but not this time. No sir. Here is a picture of Snowball V last night, just before he founded Kilrah...



OK, maybe having a settler named after your suggestion is a little lame, but, well, if you think about it it DOES fit. I mean, we're talking Snowball here, and what other unit is guaranteed to dissappear soon after creation?

Besides, you're probably the only lurker of one of these games that gets a settler named for their suggestion? Don't you feel unique?!

At least you didn't get laughed at when you suggested a name like Sulla did when I wanted a unit named after Cornwallis

[Maniac Marshall]

I have adjusted the micro plan SLIGHTLY, only with regards to Berlioz and Dutchess. It "wastes" a worker turn, but gets the pigs online faster, which is big as it allows us to whip a library there faster if desired. Right now i'm thinking chop, chop whip on library, then when boarders expand, chop, chop on forests for a grainery. I need to get another worker over here soon to get the wines online.

EDIT: OK, I made another change. Ignore the above. I nixed the library in Kilrah in favor of this plan. Build Grainery, which we'll need anyhow, use the missionary to convert the city for culture/boarder expansion. When the city grows to size 2 we can single whip the grainery, and put the 2nd chop into a missionary for the capital. Reason being, other than the wines, I can't see Kilrah working a tile good for more than one coin for at least 50 years.

Turn 89
--------
Fieras builds Forge (axe on hold) works Sheep, Corn, Silver, Farm, 2 mines
Pride builds Forge (axe on hold), Works Cows, Horses, Shared Cottage and 3 mines!
Temminck builds Archer, Works Works Rice, Copper, Gold, 2 cottages.
Feng Shui builds grainery, works Farm
Kilrah builds Barracks, works Pigs
Berlioz Roads (complete)
Dutchess Moves SE-NE and chops.
Toulouse and Chimee Plantation the Dyes.
Thomas O'Malley and Oliver Move S-SE to a riverside grassland.
Oliver move SW-W to a plains forest
Marie Mines (complete)

Turn 90
--------
Fieras builds Forge (axe on hold) Works Sheep, Corn, Silver S Cottage, 2 Mines
Pride Rock builds Forge (aze on hold) works Cows, Horses, Plains Forest and 3 Mines (yes, this starves the city for a turn
Temminck builds Worker, works Rice, Copper, Gold, 2 Cottages
Feng Shui whips library, works Farm
Kilrah builds Barracks, Works Pigs
Berlioz and Dutchess move to the pigs
Toulouse and Chimee Plantation the Dyes.
Thomas and Oliver Farms.
Marie joins thomas/oliver and, farms


Turn 91
--------
Fierias tripple whips forge, works Sheep, Corn, SW cottage, Silver.
Pride Rock double whipps forge, works Cows, Farm, new grass farm, shared cottage.
Temminck builds Worker, works Rice, Copper, Gold, 2 Cottages
Feng Shui builds grainery, works farm
Kilrah works pigs, builds Barracks
Berlioz and Dutchess pasture the pigs
Chimeee Plantations (Complete)
Toulouse moves S-S to a gems hill
Thomas and Marie Farm (Complete)
Oliver moves W-W-NW to a plains forest

Turn 92
--------
Fierias completes forge, starts catapult, works Sheep, Corn, Silver, SW Cottage
Pride Rock grows to size 5, builds archer, Works Cows, Horses, Farm, Shared Cottage, Grass Mine
Temminck builds Worker, works Rice, Copper, Gold, 2 Cottages
Feng Shui builds grainery, works farm
Kilrah works pigs, builds Barracks
Berlioz and Dutchess Pasture (complete)
Chimeee moves S and roads
Toulouse roads
Thomas and Marie Road
Oliver Chops

Turn 93
--------
Currency recieved, research BACK ON!
Fierias grows to size 5, builds catapult, works Corn, Sheep, Silver, S Cottage, SW Cottage
Pride Rock builds archer, works Cows, Horses, Farm, Shared Cottage, Grass Mine
Temminck builds worker, works Rice, Copper, Gold, 2 Cottages
Feng Shui builds grainery, works farm
Kilrah works pigs, builds Barracks
Berlioz and Dutchess road (Complete)
Chimeee roads (Complete)
Toulouse roads (Complete)
Thomas and Marie move SE-E and road
Oliver chops

Turn 94
--------
Fierias builds catapult, works Corn, Sheep, Silver, S Cottage, SW Cottage
Pride Rock Finishes Archer, starts Stable, works Cows, horses, Farm, Shared Cottage, Grass Cottage.
Temminck builds worker, works Rice, Copper, Gold, 2 Cottages
Feng Shui builds grainery, works farm
Kilrah works pigs, builds Barracks
Berlioz Moves NW, NW into a forest.
Dutchess moves NW, SW and chops
Chimeee moves to the gems and chops
Toulouse chops
Thomas and Marie move to the dyes and road.
Oliver chops (complete)

[RefSteel]

Thanks for all the work you've done on this lately, Maniac and Cull! Quick suggestions before I disappear for most of the weekend (as usual) follow:

1) My understanding is that we plan to chop out a granary in Kilrah, use Krill's missionary gift there, and whip out a missionary of our own from there. Assuming that's right, bear in mind we have to revolt to OR before we can build the Miss. Assuming we do so before we get CS and it's a 1 turn revolt either way, we should presumably go to HR and OR simultaneously.

2) I think we should start research sooner than suggested in the microplan posted above; we should plan to RUN OUT of gold (except for some emergency upgrade cash) on T93 when Currency comes in and we start getting funded from outside.

[Maniac Marshall]

Thanks for all the work you've done on this lately, Maniac and Cull! Quick suggestions before I disappear for most of the weekend (as usual) follow:

1) My understanding is that we plan to chop out a granary in Kilrah, use Krill's missionary gift there, and whip out a missionary of our own from there. Assuming that's right, bear in mind we have to revolt to OR before we can build the Miss. Assuming we do so before we get CS and it's a 1 turn revolt either way, we should presumably go to HR and OR simultaneously.

2) I think we should start research sooner than suggested in the microplan posted above; we should plan to RUN OUT of gold (except for some emergency upgrade cash) on T93 when Currency comes in and we start getting funded from outside.

Regarding point 1a, I have sandboxed it since, and we won't even need to whip the garinery. By the time we get the pigs online, a grass hill mined, and that forest chopped, the city will be able to build the grainery in a timely fashion, delaying growth for one turn, so that it will have the grainery just before growing to size 3 for the cost of just one chop.

Regarding point 1b.

A) I'm still not convinced we need monarchy right away. Yes, if we get into a defensive war and they start pillaging our happy makers, it's super useful, but with a Forge and a Ball Court, we're happy till like size 16.

B) Krill's missionary is standing near Ruff's Archer (taunting the Bhuddist dogs?) just outside our boarder looking like the Piper at the Gates of Dawn (name the group that did that album w/o looking it up anyone?) He will be safely in our lands sometime this turn I think (if not then next turn. I can't check these things) We could obv revolt to OR, but I'm similarly not sure it's that beneficial? Once we have one city with religion, it will likely spread on it's own, right?

C) I believe Civil Service is just around the corner (T99-100). We WILL want to revolt to that. Now, correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't THINK there is anything comming up soon after CS that we'd want to revolt to? If that's the case, then as I see it it's a case of what we want more. OR/HR along with CS.

Regarding point 2, I already decided we were going to start research next turn, after we whip away FIVE pop for them forges and go from working hammers to food/commerce. (We're #1 in hammers this turn by a WIDE margin this turn btw, almost 10 IIRC)

[Maniac Marshall]

OK, Swiss sent us an email earlier wanting our ok to plant a city halfway between us that grabs gems. I originally responded sure, but I thought we wanted a city north of it. Here is the situation. The picture is theirs, the crayons are mine.



Their proposed spot fits reasonably well with our dotmap, and does not overlap, so I don't think we can object too vociferously.

That yellow spot, jeez, we want that spot! I think we should found it BEFORE Savannah so the Aztecs (see the green at the bottom!) don't get it.

As for that city in the north... uhh



That's one of the dryest, no food spots on the entire map. Other than the flood plain and the spices it's hideously awful. The ONLY reason to put a city there would be to get the stone. Honesly, should we even bother.

Anyway, I'm now thinking of responding that they can have the site, but we would want notification and right of refusal if they panted a city either north or south of that spot. thoughts?

[Maniac Marshall]

Actually, with the major uncertianty of getting green at all, we should probably move yellow 1W off the river, which loses health and levee, but picks up the sugar and a couple of riverside plots? Thoughts?

[Cull]

Actually, with the major uncertianty of getting green at all, we should probably move yellow 1W off the river, which loses health and levee, but picks up the sugar and a couple of riverside plots? Thoughts?

Agreed.

Stone site is only there for stone. With the stone site, how about we say they can have it, IF they let us use the stone on request? Worst they can do is say no. Well, they could declare war....