RB Pitboss #1 SPOILER - Catherine of Sumeria

[kalin]

We discussed switching direction from NE to NW, but on reflection, I feel sticking with NE is better - maps are generally longer in the E-W direction, so concentrating distance in one of those should give us more progress than concentrating on going N-S.

I thought about that fact (maps longer along the E-W axis) but this is supposed to be an unusual map.

I notice a hill (unforested) 2N of the warrior and coast or another lake 2SE.

I think too that E is probably the way to go and I think that NE and SE are options.

Kalin

[kalin]

Corn - until size2
Corn + grass forest hill - 5turns
Corn + grass forest - until size3

I just reviewed this plan and I think there's a small problem:

* Corn - until size 2 => on turn 9 we have: 6H in the warrior, 2H in the scout, and 2F in the box.

* Corn + grass forest hill - 5turns => (turns 10-14), that means that we get the scout out on turn 15! At this point we'd have 12F in the box and can grow to size 3 in 4 turns @2H/turn which is turn 19.

I think my previous more MM intensive plan was 1 turn shorter. We can still stick to it. On the current turn we work the corn, then switch to a hill for 1F/2H, then follow the steps from size 2.

I usually don't do a lot of MM, but in the beginning I feel it matters the most, and in this game one has a lot of time to think things over

Let me know if I am missing something here.

Kalin

[Dreylin]

I just reviewed this plan and I think there's a small problem:

* Corn - until size 2 => on turn 9 we have: 6H in the warrior, 2H in the scout, and 2F in the box.

* Corn + grass forest hill - 5turns => (turns 10-14), that means that we get the scout out on turn 15! At this point we'd have 12F in the box and can grow to size 3 in 4 turns @2H/turn which is turn 19.

I think my previous more MM intensive plan was 1 turn shorter. We can still stick to it. On the current turn we work the corn, then switch to a hill for 1F/2H, then follow the steps from size 2.

I usually don't do a lot of MM, but in the beginning I feel it matters the most, and in this game one has a lot of time to think things over

Let me know if I am missing something here.

Kalin

Kalin,

I think you missed out t9 there in your calculations; and I'm not certain whether the initial turn is t1, or t0. Here's what I get when I just write the whole thing out assuming t1:

t01: 0/22f 0/15h(Warrior) - working Corn (3f, 1h)
t02: 3/22f 1/15h(Warrior) - working Corn (3f, 1h)
t03: 6/22f 2/15h(Warrior) - working Corn (3f, 1h)
t04: 9/22f 3/15h(Warrior) - working Corn (3f, 1h)
t05: 12/22f 4/15h(Warrior) - working Corn (3f, 1h)
t06: 15/22f 5/15h(Warrior) - working Corn (3f, 1h) - Hunting
t07: 18/22f 0/15h(Scout) - working Corn (3f, 1h) - Warrior paused at 6h
t08: 21/22f 1/15h(Scout) - working Corn (3f, 1h)
t09: 2/24f 2/15h(Scout) - working Corn & forest grass hill (2f, 3h)
t10: 4/24f 5/15h(Scout) - working Corn & forest grass hill (2f, 3h)
t11: 6/24f 8/15h(Scout) - working Corn & forest grass hill (2f, 3h)
t12: 8/24f 11/15h(Scout) - working Corn & forest grass hill (2f, 3h)
t13: 10/24f 14/15h(Scout) - working Corn & forest grass hill (2f, 3h) - Scout
t14: 12/24f 8/15h(Warrior) - working Corn & forest grass (3f, 2h) - Mining
t15: 15/24f 10/15h(Warrior) - working Corn & forest grass (3f, 2h)
t16: 18/24f 12/15h(Warrior) - working Corn & forest grass (3f, 2h)
t17: 21/24f 14/15h(Warrior) - working Corn & forest grass (3f, 2h) - Warrior
t18: 0/26f 1/60h(Worker) - working Corn & 2xforest grass (3f, 3h)
t19: 0/26f 7/60h(Worker)

Basically, if we worked the maximum food tiles the whole time, we would grow to size 3 at the end of t16, and start t17 with 2f in the box. At that point we would have a total of 24h invested in units. Between size2 & size3 we get a 1-1 trade-off of food for hammers so we can achieve growth on the same turn:

t17: 48f 24h
t17: 46f 26h

By delaying growth we gain an additional 5 food or hammers, so get to:

t18: 46f 31h

With Scout moving first on t14, Warrior moving first on t18, and Worker moving first on t28. Start t29: 3f, 4h invested.


If we went max-growth for the whole time we get:

t09: 2/24f 2/15h(Scout) - working Corn & forest grass (3f, 2h)
t10: 5/24f 4/15h(Scout) - working Corn & forest grass (3f, 2h)
t11: 8/24f 6/15h(Scout) - working Corn & forest grass (3f, 2h)
t12: 11/24f 8/15h(Scout) - working Corn & forest grass (3f, 2h)
t13: 14/24f 10/15h(Scout) - working Corn & forest grass (3f, 2h)
t14: 17/24f 12/15h(Scout) - working Corn & forest grass (3f, 2h)
t15: 20/24f 14/15h(Scout) - working Corn & forest grass (3f, 2h) - Scout
t16: 23/24f 7/15h(Warrior) - working Corn & forest grass (3f, 2h)
t17: 2/26f 9/15h(Warrior) - working Corn & 2xforest grass (3f, 3h)
t18: 5/26f 12/15h(Warrior) - working Corn & 2xforest grass (3f, 3h) - Warrior
t19: 8/26f 0/60h(Worker) - working Corn & 2xforest grass (3f, 3h)

With Scout moving first on t16, Warrior moving first on t19, and Worker moving first on t29. Start t29: 8f invested.


Alternatively, we could trade the 2f overflow after growth to size3 for hammers:

t13: 14/24f 10/15h(Scout) - working Corn & forest grass hill (2f, 3h)
t14: 16/24f 13/15h(Scout) - working Corn & forest grass hill (2f, 3h) - Scout
t15: 18/24f 7/15h(Warrior) - working Corn & forest grass (3f, 2h)
t16: 21/24f 9/15h(Warrior) - working Corn & forest grass (3f, 2h)
t17: 0/26f 11/15h(Warrior) - working Corn & 2xforest grass (3f, 3h)
t18: 3/26f 14/15h(Warrior) - working Corn & 2xforest grass (3f, 3h) - Warrior
t19: 6/26f 2/60h(Worker) - working Corn & 2xforest grass (3f, 3h)

With Scout moving first on t15, Warrior moving first on t19, and Worker moving first on t29. Start t29: 6f, 2h invested.


So to summarise:

Scenario A: Scout t14, Warrior t18, Worker t28 and on t29 - 3f, 4h
Scenario B: Scout t16, Warrior t19, Worker t29 and on t29 - 8f, 0h
Scenario C: Scout t15, Warrior t19, Worker t29 and on t29 - 6f, 2h

So of these, we are trading off food & production for additional exploration & a Worker turn.

The other option is to maximise growth to size3 and then immediately switch to a Worker without completing the Warrior. If all goes to plan, that gives us an extra Worker turn on t27, but costs us 10t of exploration with the Warrior - which wouldn't complete until t29.

[Dreylin]

With Scout moving first on t14, Warrior moving first on t18, and Worker moving first on t28. Start t29: 3f, 4h invested.

Actually, on reflection we could start t29 with either 3f, 4h or 4h, 3f invested (by running only 4t of the Corn & grass forest hill) without affecting the build dates of any of the units.

I think 4f, 3h may be better, so suggest 4t only.

[kalin]

Thanks for the detailed analysis. I always get confused by turn index etc.

I still think I spot an error in scenario A:

t11: 6/24f 8/15h(Scout) - working Corn & forest grass hill (2f, 3h)
t12: 8/24f 11/15h(Scout) - working Corn & forest grass hill (2f, 3h)
t13: 10/24f 14/15h(Scout) - working Corn & forest grass hill (2f, 3h) - Scout

Here's my proposal:

t01: 0/22f 0/15h(Warrior) - working Corn (3f, 1h)
t02: 3/22f 1/15h(Warrior) - working Corn (3f, 1h)
t03: 6/22f 2/15h(Warrior) - working Corn (3f, 1h)
t04: 9/22f 3/15h(Warrior) - working Corn (3f, 1h)
t05: 12/22f 4/15h(Warrior) - working Corn (3f, 1h)
t06: 15/22f 5/15h(Warrior) - working Corn (3f, 1h) - Hunting

t07: 18/22f 0/15h(Scout) - working Corn (3f, 1h) - Warrior paused at 6h -- WE ARE HERE
t08: 21/22f 1/15h(Scout) - working Forest grass hill (1f, 3h)
t09: 0/24f 4/15h(Scout) - working Corn & forest grass hill (2f, 3h)
t10: 2/24f 7/15h(Scout) - working Corn & forest grass hill (2f, 3h)
t11: 4/24f 10/15h(Scout) - working Corn & forest grass hill (2f, 3h)
t12: 6/24f 13/15h(Scout) - working Corn & forest (3f, 2h)
t13: 9/24f 15/15h(Scout) - working Corn & forest (3f, 2h) - Scout

t14: 12/24f 8/15h(Warrior) - working Corn & forest grass (3f, 2h) - Mining
t15: 15/24f 10/15h(Warrior) - working Corn & forest grass (3f, 2h)
t16: 18/24f 12/15h(Warrior) - working Corn & forest grass (3f, 2h)
t17: 21/24f 14/15h(Warrior) - working Corn & forest grass (3f, 2h) - Warrior
t18: 0/26f 1/60h(Worker) - working Corn & 2xforest grass (3f, 3h)
t19: 0/26f 7/60h(Worker)

EDIT: I missed this:

Actually, on reflection we could start t29 with either 3f, 4h or 4h, 3f invested (by running only 4t of the Corn & grass forest hill) without affecting the build dates of any of the units.

I think 4f, 3h may be better, so suggest 4t only.

I assume you meant either 3F/4H or 4F/3H I haven't thought that far to be honest. I thought at size 3 we have 6 H+F going into the worker for exactly 10 turns, which means that on turn 28/29 (still confused) we end up with whatever we had on turn 18/19...

Kalin

[Dreylin]

OK, correcting a couple of details in your proposal:

t01: 0/22f 0/15h(Warrior) - working Corn (3f, 1h)
t02: 3/22f 1/15h(Warrior) - working Corn (3f, 1h)
t03: 6/22f 2/15h(Warrior) - working Corn (3f, 1h)
t04: 9/22f 3/15h(Warrior) - working Corn (3f, 1h)
t05: 12/22f 4/15h(Warrior) - working Corn (3f, 1h)
t06: 15/22f 5/15h(Warrior) - working Corn (3f, 1h) - Hunting

t07: 18/22f 0/15h(Scout) - working Corn (3f, 1h) - Warrior paused at 6h -- WE ARE HERE
t08: 21/22f 1/15h(Scout) - working Forest grass hill (1f, 3h)
t09: 0/24f 4/15h(Scout) - working Corn & forest grass hill (2f, 3h)
t10: 2/24f 7/15h(Scout) - working Corn & forest grass hill (2f, 3h)
t11: 4/24f 10/15h(Scout) - working Corn & forest grass hill (2f, 3h)
t12: 6/24f 13/15h(Scout) - working Corn & forest (3f, 2h) - Scout

t13: 9/24f 6/15h(Warrior) - working Corn & forest (3f, 2h)
t14: 12/24f 8/15h(Warrior) - working Corn & forest grass (3f, 2h) - Mining
t15: 15/24f 10/15h(Warrior) - working Corn & forest grass (3f, 2h)
t16: 18/24f 12/15h(Warrior) - working Corn & forest grass (3f, 2h)
t17: 21/24f 14/15h(Warrior) - working Corn & forest grass (3f, 2h) - Warrior
t18: 0/26f 1/60h(Worker) - working Corn & 2xforest grass (3f, 3h)
t19: 0/26f 7/60h(Worker)

This is excellent, it gains us an extra turn of exploration with the Scout at the cost of taking away our option to overflow 1h or 1f into t28.

[kalin]

Moved NE as agreed, changed the tile worked in the capital to a grass hill.

EDIT: I spot what appears to be a desert hill 2N1W of the warrior. Other than that not much to report.

Kalin

[kalin]

I suggest we move the warrior SE. I think I spot an unforested spot 2 SE of the warrior.

Also, I logged in and rearranged the capital to work 2 forests (2F/1H). I didn't move the warrior yet until we make a decision.

I also had a look at the demogs and it seems we are one of only 2 civs with all land at the capital. I'd like to know why we have the highest score? Because we discovered hunting? Anyway the demogs have some interesting general information, worth taking a look at.

There is a lion 3NE of the capital, left a sign in game. It seems that it appeared rather quickly.

K

[Dreylin]

I suggest we move the warrior SE. I think I spot an unforested spot 2 SE of the warrior.

Moving SE, it's a grass hill. Probably want to move onto it next turn to see.

[Dreylin]

Moving SE, it's a grass hill. Probably want to move onto it next turn to see.

Onto the hill - Cows!

I check our progress against the master plan - seems like the game counter starts from t0, so we are on course on t10 of the plan though the game reads t9.