Civilization 5 Announced

[Imhotep]

Correct Atlas, toroidal maps wrap both ways and are actually played in MP. I just fear that Firaxis will again develop the game with sole view on the SP experience and leave the MP crowd again with a game that comes out of the box broken. Sure, we know too little to judge that now, but some of the changes already announced make me wonder how they could work in a competitive MP environment.

Take the "units limited by resources" thing for example. If it really works that way that x resources allow x units only, this will make the game more dependant on land quality that it is now already.

I just hope they know what they do...

[Sirian]

If it really works that way that x resources allow x units only, this will make the game more dependant on land quality that it is now already.

It's already hugely dependent on land quality. You don't see a lot of mp games played out on map scripts that produce a wide variety of situations. The last I knew, the favorites were Team Battleground and Inland Sea, both of which have no sections of harsh terrain types, and plenty of fudge in the direction of "fairness" between start point locations and quality. And that wasn't even enough, so they added the option for "balanced" resources to every single map script in BTS, to try to widen the MP options. (I think there's room for improvement on how that was done, but it's one of the few things with the Civ4 maps I didn't handle.)

But you are right: if such a change were made, it would even further increase sensitivity to map conditions, via-a-vis resource distribution. So one would hope they realize this.

Balance and Variety are polar opposites. It would be good if they cover both poles and a healthy range of blended results in the middle, for both SP and MP players.


Anyway, I was on a short break. Now back to work for me.


- Sirian

[BobRoberts]

I hope it ships with colour blind support as a core option. Cultural colour with different textures for each country would do nicely.

Which, from my totally unbiased viewpoint, all games should!

[Krill]

It's already hugely dependent on land quality. You don't see a lot of mp games played out on map scripts that produce a wide variety of situations. The last I knew, the favorites were Team Battleground and Inland Sea, both of which have no sections of harsh terrain types, and plenty of fudge in the direction of "fairness" between start point locations and quality. And that wasn't even enough, so they added the option for "balanced" resources to every single map script in BTS, to try to widen the MP options. (I think there's room for improvement on how that was done, but it's one of the few things with the Civ4 maps I didn't handle.)

Balanced was added because while the start quality was relatively even, the strat resources weren't. All that happened was the the code from the Balanced map script was lifted and placed into all other map scripts, apart from TBG. It didn't worker there because the teams started so close together that other teams started closer to your resources than you did. I agree that it could have been handled better, but for a fix that only took an hour to implement and 1 day to test it was a pretty productive one.

However, thoroughly tested map scripts for MP would be preferable to the quick fixes. I definitely agree with you that there are other, better, ways for it to be conducted.

But you are right: if such a change were made, it would even further increase sensitivity to map conditions, via-a-vis resource distribution. So one would hope they realize this.

Balance and Variety are polar opposites. It would be good if they cover both poles and a healthy range of blended results in the middle, for both SP and MP players.


Anyway, I was on a short break. Now back to work for me.


- Sirian

I have quite alot of hope that these fora are read by open minded and productive Firaxian employees

One wonders if there will be any stock fast movers that don't require resources for a change. Could lead to an interesting strategy.

[Yazilliclick]

http://ie.pc.ign.com/articles/107/1074732p1.html

Some info in this article I think (I haven't read through this full thread). At least some comfirmation of speculation as well as a couple big revelations - religion and espionage removed!

[Krill]

No more espionage? Hell yeah, I like that.

[novice]

Why have they removed religion? Is it just to be politically correct? I hope they "replace" it with something, as it's a pretty big gameplay aspect in Civ4.

Maybe an extended understanding of what culture is?

[mostly_harmless]

"research priority" sounds alot like the Alpha Centauri tech system.

mh

[T-hawk]

Jon Shafer is lead designer? He did an excellent (though not flawless) job on the Final Frontier mod for BTS, so that's encouraging. Let's hope he's got the team for strong AI rather than FF's bare-minimum job on it.

I'm perfectly content if religion goes away. IMO, it's always been an overrated mechanic in Civ 4.

[Rowain]

Why have they removed religion? Is it just to be politically correct? I hope they "replace" it with something, as it's a pretty big gameplay aspect in Civ4.

Maybe an extended understanding of what culture is?

AFAIK they have removed it as system but Religion is in a way still in. It should now come in the form of a research path (I think as soziologic research or so).