[Spoilers] Shallow Thought and Hitru's series of (unfortunate?) events

[shallow_thought]

I've finished pillaging the roads around PP, so it's time to offer Charriu peace. Particularly now that we've seen what he has in Wing Raptor.




In the worst case (he peaces Elkad, not us), it might be an option to offer him a "chariot only" chance to take PP in exchange for peace by leaving the city empty and offering. I'm not sure that would be necessary, but Superdeath has halted his moves towards Magic Science, who has been whipping. He's welcome to stop and think, but I'd rather he did it further away (I managed to lose my screenshot of his stack, but he's N of IQ). Castles will go up at EE and IQ (I've been trying to finish the courthouse as EE first, assuming SD would be busy ... might change my mind). On the other hand, Elkad looks like he might still be planning to press on Wing Raptor.




We remain top in power. It's a little sneaky to check graphs after the turn roll, but we're not in a split with MS, and it's his I wanted to see.

[shallow_thought]

Charriu re-proposed peace, so - after doing what I could to check he'd not given us any nasty surprises I accepted. Superdeath continued to do sit his stack down, so we're moving our knights back into our core to cover this.




We also found Elkad's main stack. It's noteworthy that is definitely getting obsolete in the field; you can see how he might have struggled against Charriu's crossbows and macemen. Any temptation to try and take advantage of this is stronly tempered by his PS/Slavery/Theo GA. I'm expecting him to have knights in some numbers soon.




I did some calculations about where best to build courthouses, and where they were out-performed by banks. The good news is that the cities we're already building courthouses in were indeed the ones with the fastest payback. The bad news is that we don't have many more with the combination of high production and high maintenance, although that will change as they develop and inflation rises. So, we'll be perking up our economy a bit over the next few turns, but there's no magic bullet. One or two places will need markets for happy as well. I posted the power graph last turn, so here's the rest now that we've got Magic Science's back. They say that Crop Yield is the important one, right? But I think that indicates we need more workshops, to convert that food to hammers / wealth, and probably more workers. Ironically our best worker pump is probably the island city of MM: food surplus, low pop, no hammers to speak of. It can shuttle them to QQ (RFS-81's old cap) easily enough by galley.

[shallow_thought]

Very quick report for this turn , after last turn's delayed one (and no proper screenshot). Elkad has switched to Vassalage/OR rather than Despotism/Theo, and is still at war with Charriu; he has combined his stacks near Oasis (the missing screenshot for this turn) but it's not clear what he's going to do. We're calmly working on a mix of infrastructure and units. Our big knight stack is back in our core, and matches Superdeath's for numbers (16 against 15, actually, ignoring medic). Obviously we've both got a scatter elsewhere, but we're beginning to get pikes out and the odd castle up, making us the spikier - hopefully .

Here's the demos (we're saving cash for a turn while completing Literature purely on overflow). I really need to do a city count, but I think we're well ahead. We were ahead before, captured three and settled one. Superdeath captured two and settled one, Elkad, I think, may only have captured and held one city? He must be ... annoyed. Interesting that we're not first in land area. Judging from the map that's Superdeath's culture claiming a load of third-ring tiles.




I've been thinking about how quickly we can get to Cuirs, and the fact that SD is several techs up on us on that path. He has (at least) Music and Philosophy. I think he's still lacking a bunch of stuff we have (Calendar, Construction, Engineering), but none of that is actually on path to Gunpowder or Mil Trad. Hmm.

[Old Harry]

Can we see a picture of the war gains? Nicely done grabbing a chunk and then getting out of the fight.

So who/what are the threats now?

[shallow_thought]

Wow, two turns in a day. Glad we're at peace. Elkad has moved his stack back, but only by one tile. Not sure what he's up to.

Can we see a picture of the war gains? Nicely done grabbing a chunk and then getting out of the fight.

So who/what are the threats now?

So, our gains. Here is RFS-81's former cap, now QQ, and the city we'd planned to plant for about 50t, RR. At the moment they're losing first ring tiles to third-ring culture from Elkad, but caste artists will change that quickly. Getting "our" second ring tiles back, on the other hand ... could take something a bit more direct. The city only had a granary and a lighthouse, but it should grow like a weed once it gets going, and we'll give it workshops to grow onto. One possibility is to put the National Epic here (and maybe Globe), but I suspect that's overly long term thinking.




And here is what we grabbed from Charriu. Nero F is food poor but came with a granary and a very welcome lighthouse. Farms and workshops will make something of it. Note that it, too, is struggling for cultural control of its second ring, even at long range. Olaf came with many riches - granary, lighthouse, forge and market, as well as a decent food supply. Shame it's on flatland, I guess. We really want to keep this. Proximate Peril is flatland, and came with a granary and a forge. It was always a stretch without taking out Charriu, and is crushed his old culture and Superdeath's new. Starlord is a recent plant - he's already got two religions in there, using Paganism to make that worthwhile. Costs him hammers in missionaries somewhere, I guess, unless he got lucky with a Jewish spread and Elkad is pushing missionaries for his shrine maybe? As a side note, can missionaries still fail in RtR? Mine have worked on the three or so occasions I've been spreading into a city with an established religion. I'm struggling to remember from my SP games.




Speaking of culture, I've barely glanced at the graph, nor that for espionage, all game. So, it turns out we're a bit behind. Superdeath and Magic Science have clearly been building courthouses (ironically, we got CoL first), but I'm not sure how to explain Elkad's graph. I guess I need to go research my wonders.







As for the threats, number one remains Elkad and Superdeath ganging up. I'm not sure why they would trust each other enough to do that, but it would be ... awkward. We are top in score (without wonders) and in crop yield, and that may worry them. We currently have a small edge in military tech (a existing mass of knights over Elkad, pikes and castles and logistics over Superdeath); it won't last, but it should deter them.

Number two is Superdeath's tech. We know he got Taoism and the Music artist, so he's ahead of us there; he does also have CS, as I can see irrigation. So, he's ahead in the push for Curassiers. Fewer cities hurts him in some ways but does reduce his maintenance right now. Liberalism, the Taj or both could figure in his future. There is an argument we should hit him now, but he matches us for knight numbers.

Number three is Elkad's potential. I think this has been blunted by his troubles getting gains from Charriu, but he can outbuild anyone else in units with Police State, or switch back to Representation and tech hard. Having had the extra, MoM powered golden age does no harm, nor does having the Buddhist shrine.

We'll be thinking what to do about this in the days to come.

[shallow_thought]

Charriu retook Oasis from Elkad, and razed it. I think that the city site there started as Forza, was burnt and resettled by Elkad, and has then swapped hands three more times . I also think this means Elkad has gained nothing from the war. He continues to build units, judging from the power graph, but I've seen no knights yet, despite having scouts in his territory. This is all good news.




Getting a few courthouses finished has raised our break-even rate up to: 25% . We'll get a little help from castle trade routes, but they're mostly for defense. We could look at getting the forbidden palace up, but where? JS2? Building wealth at BB and BeaB takes us to 40%+, so we're not bankrupt, but we need to decide what to push. We think we can outbuild SD right now for knights, and he lacks Engineering and much collateral. So we're eyeballing him a little. Despite his stack. And slavery.




We're shopping around for marble to get the Heroic Epic up. Magic Science seems to have ... forgotten ... our generous gift of stone earlier, not responding to a 1gpt offer . We're trying dyes instead. If we get really desperate we'll offer Charriu our spare horse, despite the risks. This is partly for the epics, but also because we're going to have Music soon. SD has had it for a while (I believe), but neither Merc nor a state religion, so hasn't built the related wonder - i actually had to double check, surprised it hadn't gone. We've no real interest in a cultural victory, but Sistine could seriously shift the border pressure, and we can get it in 9t at BeaB. Frankly, if Superdeath did build it we'd probably have to declare war ASAP or see our borders crumble. Of course, that could cut the other way if we do get it...

[Old Harry]

Can you get OBs with Charriu to see if he's coming for your border cities or has emptied his capital? If not then a spy might be a good investment.

Also I wouldn't build infrastructure in those cities...

[shallow_thought]

Rules:

Espionage: On, no active missions, no spies.

Can you get OBs with Charriu to see if he's coming for your border cities or has emptied his capital? If not then a spy might be a good investment.

Also I wouldn't build infrastructure in those cities...

So, no spies (something I hadn't realised until I double checked). We're building walls in PP, and we'll get a castle started in Olaf next turn (it's currently getting a barracks, for no terribly relevant reason, but it was mostly finished ). I'd really like to hold Olaf, as it's got plenty of infrastructure already. Charriu made peace with Elkad this turn, but I'd hope he's put off by the power graph. After all, I've just offered him a spare ivory for his marble - Magic Science isn't biting, and I'd really like some shiny rock for a few turns. If he accepts we'll leave him alone for the 10t, and hope he feels the same. We should also see any attack coming - he's only got 1-movers and we have a hill sentry that can see all the way to his cap, just not quite into it.




Superdeath keeps piling on the knights. We need to match this, but I have slipped in a few theatres. The cap needs the happy (1t) and our big border cities need the culture, and they're quite cheap.

My in-laws are staying for a few days, which is one reason I'm happy to be at peace. Beyond that: I'm not feeling positive right now. We're back to the sludge of needing a huge army, with all it's costs, to deter aggression without feeling like having much chance to do anything. I just don't feel we have levers to pull. That might chance if someone leaves an opening, as Charriu did before, or if we can turn our crop yield into a decent economy or manufacturing base. So, workshop, workshop, workshop. Shame my micro is so bad.

Of course, if Charriu doesn't play nice, and I feel we can match Superdeath/Elkad while still having some spare force after we've built up for a bit, maybe we go up against those Cho-ku-nu's with knights after all.

EDIT: I completely forgot to mention the other big news this turn - MS declared on SD. I'm assuming he's fed up with the tension and it's a war-peace. Elkad may be on the march toward's him. We'll see over the next couple of turns.

[Old Harry]

Shame about the spies (strange rule given how nerfed they are), but you could put a sentry into PP (perhaps the turn you can re-declare) to see what Charriu's got in the capital. If it isn't much you might put your knight stack 2NE of the captial.

In the event that you did take his capital it'd be swamped by the culture from Wing Raptor, right?

[shallow_thought]

Shame about the spies (strange rule given how nerfed they are), but you could put a sentry into PP (perhaps the turn you can re-declare) to see what Charriu's got in the capital. If it isn't much you might put your knight stack 2NE of the captial.

In the event that you did take his capital it'd be swamped by the culture from Wing Raptor, right?

I'm shuttling a sentry HA between the hill near Olaf and PP; neither site has quite the range to see into the cap. But declaring to pop our heads in and offering more peace if it doesn't look on might work. And yes, I expect that Wing Raptor would swamp the cap with its Judaic Holy City culture.

The other issue is having enough force to simultaneously attack and deter SD. A war-peace might be part of the answer there.