[NO PLAYERS] PBEM 7 Map Making & Lurkers

[MJW (ya that one)]

I call the game for Sullla/Singaboy if Archduke/EMP-K accepts their offer.

[oledavy]

I'm pretty disappointed in Archduke and Emperor K - granted it is easy to do so when I have the omniscient viewpoint, but it feels like they're throwing the game for a small chance at victory as opposed to just holding their ground and keeping things much more interesting. I feel they are in a strong position to win even if they come under attack from Sullla and Singaboy. 

They vastly overestimate Sullla/Singaboy's potential threat, and underrate their own ability to punch out. Combined with this is seemingly a complete misread of Woden/CMF's activities (Settling up on "their land.") Their complaining also rings a little hollow, as it makes sense than in the aftermath of a prolonged war that a team would sit back and farm for a bit. It's not like Woden and CMF have signed game-long NAPs with Sulla/Singaboy in the interim, they've hardly left Archduke and Emperor K out to dry. They even indicated as such with their deal. The vagaries of AI diplo I suppose, but in the interim, Archduke and Emperor K have done nothing but farm the entire game now panic the first time any military pressure is threatened. 

Archduke is an experienced commander and should be smarter than this, he has to know Sullla and Singaboy won't be able to make too much progress against his entrenched defenders, and they can do real damage to China. Meanwhile, siding with China and Rome means they'll be attacking into a bottleneck while Rome gets to use the open fields of the Japper007/Cornflakes continent. 

Anyway, suffice it to say, I'm rather tired of these endgame three ways being resolved by the number 2 and 3 players fighting each other. If Sullla is going to win, he should have to work for it a little harder than that. Starting next to Japper007 and then getting the #2 team to assault the #3 at his behest, it's almost too easy.

[aetryn]

I'm pretty disappointed in Archduke and Emperor K - granted it is easy to do so when I have the omniscient viewpoint, but it feels like they're throwing the game for a small chance at victory as opposed to just holding their ground and keeping things much more interesting. I feel they are in a strong position to win even if they come under attack from Sullla and Singaboy. 

They vastly overestimate Sullla/Singaboy's potential threat, and underrate their own ability to punch out. Combined with this is seemingly a complete misread of Woden/CMF's activities (Settling up on "their land.") Their complaining also rings a little hollow, as it makes sense than in the aftermath of a prolonged war that a team would sit back and farm for a bit. It's not like Woden and CMF have signed game-long NAPs with Sulla/Singaboy in the interim, they've hardly left Archduke and Emperor K out to dry. They even indicated as such with their deal. The vagaries of AI diplo I suppose, but in the interim, Archduke and Emperor K have done nothing but farm the entire game now panic the first time any military pressure is threatened. 

Archduke is an experienced commander and should be smarter than this, he has to know Sullla and Singaboy won't be able to make too much progress against his entrenched defenders, and they can do real damage to China. Meanwhile, siding with China and Rome means they'll be attacking into a bottleneck while Rome gets to use the open fields of the Japper007/Cornflakes continent. 

Anyway, suffice it to say, I'm rather tired of these endgame three ways being resolved by the number 2 and 3 players fighting each other. If Sullla is going to win, he should have to work for it a little harder than that. Starting next to Japper007 and then getting the #2 team to assault the #3 at his behest, it's almost too easy.

In fact, Woden/CMF declined a DoF extension so they could be free to help take down Rome/China, trying to set up your ideal scenario, and their reward is going to be getting attacked by both other teams. In retrospect, they probably should have signed the DoF. All game people have been overestimating the speed at which you can conquer enemies: for instance Sullla's suspicion of Nubia attacking him when they were just getting into position to attack Khmer, and feeling that Nubia should have conquered Khmer faster than they did. I think Woden/CMF overestimated how much damage Germany would have actually taken in another 10 turns of fighting and undervalued firming up the diplomatic situation a bit more. 

On the other hand, Nubia did use its military muscle to secure some extra contested land, and the ill will that generated is apparently now coming back to bite them. I agree that I don't really understand the "they're taking some turns to build up their empire instead of preparing for war" argument.

[MJW (ya that one)]

I evilgasamed at CMF's post.

[hzhp800]

I don't understand why theArchduke took an alliance. I disagree with the whole strategy, but even if you want to cooperate with Sulla/Singaboy against Woden/CMF they could just offer a DOF on their turn. There is no need to share vision and reveal the map to them.

[Old Harry]

I like Woden's #1 theory - Archduke still being shell-shocked after pbem 1 seems the best explanation for such an odd decision.

[MJW (ya that one)]

My problem with Archduke's plan is that Sullla is too good to take out without a 2v1. He lost 4 times. One where he wasn't the main turnplayer so it doesn't count, two by diplo BS (one was 3v1 and other was LP not getting attacked due to diplo) and one by an unwinnable map (SevenSpirits getting a private island). It's better to suffer and hope to outplay Woden/CMF then kill them and then lose to Sullla.

[MJW (ya that one)]

I still call the game for S+S even through it will be harder. The DoF will waste too much time.

[BRickAstley]

Everyone doesn't want to war with anyone else for fear of a backstab. Man wouldn't it be great if we got into a 3-way cold war necessitating a race to space.

[ebbitten]

Everyone doesn't want to war with anyone else for fear of a backstab. Man wouldn't it be great if we got into a 3-way cold war necessitating a race to space.

Given the opportunities for overlapping DOfs I do wonder if archduke and Cmf could have signaled better against s/s.


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