RBPB3 - Gandhi of the Egyptians

[Krill]

Chat with Ruff...

(10:58:14 PM) Krill: Ruff
(10:58:19 PM) Krill: you there?
(10:58:33 PM) ruff.hi: yes
(10:58:43 PM) Krill: India are bugging me about map of Exploits land
(10:58:54 PM) ruff.hi: they have what I have
(10:58:57 PM) ruff.hi: I don't have much
(10:59:04 PM) Krill: OK
(10:59:22 PM) Krill: If they have what you have sent them then that makes it easier for me to explain...
(11:20:48 PM) Krill: So...you heard the news about Exploit?
(11:30:49 PM) ruff.hi: news of Exploit? no I did not
(11:32:20 PM) Krill: Rome is in Exploits Pocket and gave info over to Exploit
(11:33:56 PM) Krill: You have a nice little 3v3 up there in the north it seems...
(11:54:42 PM) ruff.hi: I thought we were in the south
(11:55:06 PM) ruff.hi: and hopefully it is 4v3 (Aztec, India, HRE, Otto) v (Rome, Inca, Exploit)
(11:56:04 PM) Krill: Damned toroidal screwing with my perceptions
(11:56:24 PM) ruff.hi: http://www.gametrailers.com/video/debut-...on-v/62388
(11:56:25 PM) Krill: And I'm not sure of hte HRE, I think they want to focus on France
(11:56:54 PM) ruff.hi: don't people knw anything about applying maximum pressure
(11:57:16 PM) Krill: Thanks for hte trailer
(11:57:25 PM) Krill: I'm waiting for one that ahs gameplay in it
(11:58:41 PM) Krill: heh, this is a TBG map
(11:58:51 PM) ruff.hi: totally
(11:58:57 PM) ruff.hi: have yo useen that trailer before?
(11:59:01 PM) Krill: maximum pressure aproaches don;t work...
(11:59:04 PM) Krill: yeah
(11:59:08 PM) Krill: about a week ago maybe?
(11:59:42 PM) ruff.hi: no - I mean applicaiton of force
(11:59:56 PM) ruff.hi: bring all of your force to 1 point - not spread it all over the place
(3/3/2010 12:00:00 AM) Krill: yeah.
(12:00:06 AM) Krill: it doesn;t work on a TBG map
(12:00:12 AM) Krill: Don;t try it.
(12:00:25 AM) ruff.hi: because everyone has 7 other neighbours
(12:00:28 AM) Krill: yeah
(12:00:41 AM) ruff.hi: so you buddy up to some and kill the others
(12:00:44 AM) Krill: and they won;t need to stack their armies to take you out if you did that
(12:00:48 AM) ruff.hi: you read any Dune?
(12:00:55 AM) Krill: only the second one
(12:01:00 AM) ruff.hi: ???
(12:01:02 AM) ruff.hi: not the first book
(12:01:06 AM) Krill: Nope
(12:01:14 AM) ruff.hi: you are missing out
(12:01:22 AM) Krill: I read an excerpt. Seemed boring
(12:01:34 AM) ruff.hi: the sudicka (sp) when pressed fight in 3s with their backs to their buddies
(12:02:05 AM) ruff.hi: and the 2nd one wasn't?
(12:02:16 AM) Krill: the second one I read to get to lseep
(12:02:27 AM) ruff.hi: lol
(12:02:34 AM) ruff.hi: yeah - well that works too
(12:02:54 AM) ruff.hi: I really like the first one ... wheels within wheels
(12:03:15 AM) ruff.hi: and he is a master story teller ... don't bother with the ones by his son and that Anderson chap -= they are total crap
(12:03:43 AM) Krill: No one beats Pratchett
(12:03:52 AM) Krill: if you claim otherwise I'm declaring a holy war on you
(12:04:00 AM) ruff.hi: true but he can get a little boring after the 30th book
(12:04:18 AM) ruff.hi: well - he and I share most of a surname so I have to think his books are ok
(12:04:25 AM) ruff.hi: apparently he is a bit of a dipstick
(12:04:57 AM) ruff.hi: from a sample size of 1 person who met him at a book signing
(12:04:59 AM) Krill: Distance between genius and insanity is measured only by success...
(12:05:02 AM) ruff.hi: so not much weight to it really
(12:05:22 AM) Krill: fair enough
(12:05:45 AM) ruff.hi: hey - do you know of any civ4 battle odd calculators
(12:05:52 AM) ruff.hi: I want to calculate my odds of surviving
(12:06:33 AM) Krill: um, stack combat, no. I'd say speak to Memphus because he knows more about that than me, but a) I don;t know what he is doing now and b) you'll get accused of cheating.
(12:06:49 AM) ruff.hi: don't worry ... google is your friend
(12:06:49 AM) ruff.hi: http://home.comcast.net/~proc/civ4/combat.htm
(12:07:05 AM) ruff.hi: at the moment it is 3 v 4 (me)
(12:07:12 AM) ruff.hi: so the same as 1v1 3 times
(12:07:24 AM) ruff.hi: lol @ cheeting comment
(12:07:28 AM) ruff.hi: was that ever resolved?
(12:08:13 AM) Krill: no. I even have proof of Sullla stating he thinks Memphus and I cheated, even afetr the mods found no evidence after trawling through the game and the forum
(12:08:33 AM) ruff.hi: I read some of that thread ... not much
(12:08:46 AM) Krill: nah...this isn;t in any thread
(12:08:48 AM) ruff.hi: and you cannot base anything on a random string of numbers
(12:08:52 AM) ruff.hi: oh
(12:09:26 AM) Krill: Yeah...fwiw, don;t count on sullla as a game admin.
(12:09:46 AM) Krill: but anyway, to more pleasant matters...
(12:10:24 AM) Krill: er...
(12:10:31 AM) Krill: that combat calc is for 1.52...
(12:10:44 AM) Krill: I think the calculations have changed since then...
(12:11:06 AM) ruff.hi: yeah - but close enough (ish)
(12:11:54 AM) Krill: Well, with a warrior and 2 archers you are safe
(12:12:06 AM) Krill: with a warrior and 3 archers all he can ever do is choke
(12:13:04 AM) Krill: the warrior is the key unit
(12:13:14 AM) Krill: because that neutralises the quechua
(12:14:14 AM) ruff.hi: well - that calc said my 10% fortified archer v the Q ... the Q has a 7% chance of victory
(12:14:19 AM) ruff.hi: the axe has a 21% chance
(12:14:41 AM) Krill: yeah...but you can save 10 hammers having the warrior compared to the archer
(12:14:52 AM) Krill: might make a difference getting out the archers fast enough
(12:15:07 AM) ruff.hi: Q v Warrior has 3%
(12:15:13 AM) ruff.hi: so warrior should defend against Q
(12:15:17 AM) Krill: yup
(12:16:04 AM) ruff.hi: they have 1 more A coming in
(12:16:09 AM) ruff.hi: total of 3A and 1Q
(12:16:18 AM) Krill: 3 archers and a warrior
(12:16:26 AM) ruff.hi: yes
(12:16:26 AM) Krill: hmmm, that is alot...
(12:16:35 AM) ruff.hi: so they cannot kill me that turn
(12:16:54 AM) Krill: Dude, odds of them killing you at all are kinda small
(12:16:56 AM) ruff.hi: and I can add 1 archer per turn for the next 3 turns after that
(12:17:13 AM) ruff.hi: yeah - really glad I landed Archery when I did
(12:17:27 AM) Krill: jesus...
(12:18:12 AM) Krill: that is alot of archers :D
(12:19:17 AM) Krill: just wondering, but what is going to happen with your second city?
(12:19:29 AM) Krill: You got that defended well enough?
(12:22:40 AM) ruff.hi: that is a good question
(12:22:57 AM) ruff.hi: at the moment it is defended by 2W and 1A
(12:23:11 AM) ruff.hi: it has a Q at its doors
(12:23:20 AM) ruff.hi: the other units might walk over and kill it
(12:23:27 AM) Krill: can you kill the Q next turn?
(12:23:39 AM) ruff.hi: I checked the odds ... less than 5%
(12:23:48 AM) Krill: oh, on a forest?
(12:23:51 AM) ruff.hi: yes
(12:23:56 AM) ruff.hi: couldn't chop it in time
(12:24:19 AM) ruff.hi: if they walk over, that takes time ... and time is what I am buying at the moment
(12:24:39 AM) Krill: If you want a bit of help with the MM and tactics, I can help you out with it.
(12:24:54 AM) ruff.hi: tbh - I should have moved that city 1 tile S so if they raze it - I get to move it
(12:25:07 AM) ruff.hi: I rushed the settlement a little - stupid
(12:25:16 AM) ruff.hi: nah - just turtleing at the moment
(12:25:17 AM) ruff.hi: but thx
(12:25:19 AM) Krill: Yeah, I was thinking 1S was the best city placement
(12:25:32 AM) Krill: now yu lsot hte flood plain for ever, man
(12:25:33 AM) ruff.hi: you can see that
(12:25:37 AM) ruff.hi: oh - you have my maps - duh
(12:25:47 AM) ruff.hi: really - dopn't get it back
(12:25:52 AM) ruff.hi: turns back to desert?
(12:26:14 AM) Krill: yup
(12:26:21 AM) Krill: the flood plain is an overlay
(12:26:37 AM) Krill: never settle on flood plains if you can help it
(12:26:40 AM) ruff.hi: oh - might resettle there and leave the piggies for another city then
(12:27:02 AM) ruff.hi: or just fight the inca off and not have to worry about resettle
(12:28:05 AM) Krill: well, I take it that the Incan units are 63 of your capital?
(12:28:17 AM) ruff.hi: do you see the sign with T55? on it
(12:28:20 AM) Krill: y
(12:28:27 AM) ruff.hi: that is where they landed
(12:28:33 AM) Krill: What, all of them?
(12:28:34 AM) ruff.hi: they are now 1E of my mine
(12:28:41 AM) ruff.hi: 2A1Q
(12:28:48 AM) ruff.hi: with another A at the T55 sign
(12:28:58 AM) ruff.hi: the Q near 2nd city is in the forest
(12:29:39 AM) Krill: will the forest 1SW of your cap be chopped before they get there?
(12:29:47 AM) ruff.hi: that forest is gone
(12:29:51 AM) ruff.hi: as is teh forest 1S of that
(12:30:30 AM) ruff.hi: workers currnetly chopping forests to cities W (2 tiles away from city)
(12:30:44 AM) ruff.hi: might not have time to chop the S forest depending on if (when) they move
(12:31:47 AM) Krill: FWIW, they aren't rushing you
(12:31:59 AM) Krill: they might think they are, but that is because of lack of experience
(12:32:03 AM) Krill: It's just a choke
(12:32:14 AM) ruff.hi: well - swap out my archers and put in 2 warriors
(12:32:21 AM) ruff.hi: and they most certainly are rushing me
(12:32:27 AM) Krill: Yeah
(12:32:30 AM) ruff.hi: but yeah - they aren't
(12:32:36 AM) ruff.hi: wonder if they have horses
(12:32:42 AM) Krill: er
(12:32:48 AM) Krill: dude...
(12:33:12 AM) ruff.hi: well ... if (when) they tech AH is what I mean (I guess)
(12:33:27 AM) Krill: I woundn't overly worry, but you you know you have a trade route to the Indians?
(12:33:48 AM) ruff.hi: will check in game when I get back in
(12:33:56 AM) ruff.hi: not without sailing ... right?
(12:34:17 AM) Krill: yeah
(12:34:25 AM) Krill: and strat resources are kinda at a premium right now
(12:34:35 AM) Krill: BUT
(12:34:42 AM) Krill: you can get a trade route to Ottomans as well
(12:34:54 AM) ruff.hi: will be bummed if they can get copper and horses in BFC of 2 cities
(12:35:03 AM) ruff.hi: yeah - talkin gto them about that
(12:35:05 AM) Krill: if you uncover about 2 tiles between ottomans and the rive that connects you and India
(12:35:36 AM) ruff.hi: ok - more work for my 'Find Krill' warrior
(12:35:41 AM) ruff.hi: uncover rivers
(12:35:45 AM) ruff.hi: find Portugal
(12:35:51 AM) ruff.hi: life is never easy
(12:38:08 AM) Krill: Prtugal are looking for you as well
(12:38:52 AM) Krill: Hopefully they have a warrior heading to their east
(12:39:57 AM) ruff.hi: hey - where is pbem#2 at?
(12:40:11 AM) Krill: Squareleg was on a fieldtrip until thursday
(12:40:16 AM) Krill: Febuary sucked
(12:40:25 AM) Krill: We need to set up 1 weekday
(12:40:30 AM) Krill: Weekend, rather
(12:40:39 AM) Krill: and all 5 of us just sit down and play through it
(12:40:46 AM) ruff.hi: Sooooo is finally dead in #1
(12:40:48 AM) Krill: but with your war, not likely
(12:40:54 AM) Krill: Yeah, I noticed...
(12:41:04 AM) Krill: Congratulations
(12:41:19 AM) ruff.hi: I sold 12 tanks to dreylin for 1000g and mh got the shits with me
(12:41:39 AM) ruff.hi: tried to talk dreylin into signing peace plus ROP and matching over and hitting me
(12:42:38 AM) Krill: why?
(12:42:47 AM) ruff.hi: why sell
(12:42:51 AM) ruff.hi: or why come and hit me?
(12:43:13 AM) Krill: latter, but more improtantly, where is the find Krill warrior?
(12:43:26 AM) Krill: distance from your second city please
(12:43:28 AM) ruff.hi: SWSW of prior location
(12:43:33 AM) ruff.hi: on a forest somewhere
(12:43:36 AM) ruff.hi: 1 sec
(12:43:50 AM) Krill: ok
(12:44:11 AM) ruff.hi: mh didn't like me selling tanks to dreylin I suppose
(12:44:25 AM) Krill: Can't really blame him...
(12:44:28 AM) ruff.hi: I want to see a tank with commando promo!
(12:47:01 AM) Krill: they are overrated...
(12:47:38 AM) ruff.hi: find krill is 12S 1E of 2nd city
(12:48:28 AM) Krill: cool, passed along...
(12:48:59 AM) ruff.hi: he has to go N to defog river to Otto and India
(12:49:09 AM) ruff.hi: will then head directly W to defog river to India
(12:49:36 AM) Krill: luckily for you though, only India need Sailing to trade with you
(12:55:17 AM) ruff.hi: and they have found Port?
(12:55:29 AM) Krill: yeah
(12:55:35 AM) Krill: India and Port are neighbours
(12:55:46 AM) Krill: India haven't really kept you informed, have they?
(12:55:54 AM) ruff.hi: we chat some
(12:55:58 AM) ruff.hi: but they are a bit of a hydra
(12:56:08 AM) ruff.hi: typically talk to darrell and rego
(12:56:14 AM) Krill: Yeah, same here
(12:56:23 AM) ruff.hi: strong alliances are forged between people that chat a lot
(12:56:38 AM) ruff.hi: well ... the potential for strong alliances anyway
(12:57:05 AM) ruff.hi: I would have thought that was the #1 lesson from pbem1
(12:57:12 AM) Krill: Yeah
(12:57:17 AM) Krill: I'm here, aren't I :P
(12:57:18 AM) ruff.hi: and from pb2
(12:57:23 AM) ruff.hi: yeah
(12:57:34 AM) ruff.hi: but did you see my correction comment - lol
(12:58:19 AM) Krill: Hey, if you don;t want to be an ally, just say...
(12:59:02 AM) ruff.hi: didn't say that
(12:59:07 AM) ruff.hi: just chatting

[Krill]

And a completely idiotic talk. Regoarrarr is doing his normal job of trying to shirk as much heavy lifting as possible. It makes it hard for me to not think of his game persona as a jerk...

This is now a group chat. Add another person.
Willem Oranje has joined.
DJ Civilization has joined.
Dantski (dpantski@googlemail.com) has joined.
DJ: well helllloooooooooo
Willem: hi
me: hi
Willem: ok we get sailing on t62 and could trade copper then? but we sort of need it for defense against rome
DJ: we'd only need it for a few turns
Willem: minimum is 10 we would have to pillage?
me: then trade back copper?
DJ: or couldn't we gift it back
or krill could declare war on one of us or something
Willem: ahh yeah not sure how open borders works
if we defog river to krill and krill defogs river to you
does open borders let us trade directly to you?
DJ: i don't know
maybe we could WB test it?
Willem: could do, could do. if only I wasn't so lazy
DJ: heh
Dantski: hey you weren't lazy earlier
next you tell me micro spreadsheet v51 is the last one
Willem: we aren't even up to version 14 of a full point release
only like 13.6.4 at the moment
DJ: so yeah i vote muhka does a WB test
all in favor?
Willem: but i don't think you force open borders in worldbuilder
only set ai, friendliness right?
DJ: well we wouldn't have OB -
we don't have it now
Willem: we would at t62 right?
63
DJ: oh yeah
i'm sure you can figure it out

Willem: right, you owe us horses then
that's not a trade for our copper, that's a trade for me doing worldbuilder
DJ: lol
Sent at 01:09 on Wednesday
me: erm...what was this about?
DJ: potentially having portugal ship us their copper
since exploit somehow knows about the attack and is researching hunting
me: for what, an extra turn of building axes?
DJ: though we still need to nkow if/where he has copper
well we can start axes as soon as sailing comes in
me: I thought Sailing wasn't in until t62?
In which case, that is a grand total of one extra turn, assuming India settles for their copper
oh, 2 turns
assuming 3 or more workers
Sent at 01:20 on Wednesday
DJ: well it also allows us to bring an axe or 2
rather than all chariots
Sent at 01:21 on Wednesday
me: I take it Portugal will have roaded to the river that HH is on?
Also, don;t forget that Aztecs might need a strat resource to break the choke
Sent at 01:23 on Wednesday

[Krill]

Ugh, I really need to get Portugal on my side, and get them viewing India with a bit of distrust in the back of their mind. I'm really fearful of India deciding to join forces with Exploit and carve up Portugal...perhaps more so than I should be, but Exploit is just a junky civ player that really isn't a threat by himself.

Ruff looks to be completely screwed; he is chopping out archers, and he will most likely lose his second city. Well, I'd rather he lose his capital and shrine, but, you can't have everything.

I need to keep an eye on the balance to the north (or south, whatever). I can't really afford for too many teams to grow large, they could take over well established cities. This map, difficulty, etc, places severe limits on the amount of cities you can have that are still growing and aren't productive members of the economy, so being able to assimilate productive cities is going to be a rather strong method of growth, more so than maps like RBPB1 that had shitloads of space...

I'm not sure France are going down...just have to hope HRE and England can do some of the heavy lifting there. HRE might get redirected into rear ending Rome once Rome attacks.

You lurkers must have it fun. I'd suggest one of you takes a picture of hte starting maps, and draws some front lines on it corresponding to the current alliance shakeup. Then someone send it to me please :D

[WilliamLP]

You lurkers must have it fun.

We sure do! This game has a long long way to go to match the soap opera drama of RBP2 but it's still young.

[Krill]

Message from Carthage. I haven't even read it yet. I'm think we need to grab France while we still can to make this a 9v7 (Mali/Babs/Byz/Maya are against us, as are Inca/Rome/Sumeria). Chating to India now to make them happy with it. Better be because I'm asking France via HRE with or without Indias' approval.

Greetings to our Egyptian brothers!

It is with great joy that our warrior Cassandra has met your warrior John Keel. We have been in touch with members of your tech trading alliance and want you to know that we are fully on board. As a gesture of initial good will, we offer two things:

First, we would like to offer an NAP between our two teams. How about 25 turns as an initial length?

Second, we would like to assist you in meeting England by the T62 BTTD (Big Tech Trade Date as one of our neighbors called it). We have just met England in the East, and have directed them to meet you in the north. Your warrior will have to take an unusual route to get there because of peaks... NE-NW-NE-E-E. That will keep him on the safest territory possible, as he is at 1.2 health now and we do not want to endanger your scouting unit.

Until later,

Mr. Nice Guy of Team Nice Shot

[Krill]

Message from and to HRE:

To all,


This is a heads up to tell you that after Carthage, England have officially confirmed as well their wish to be included in the Tech Cartel.

As they are close to members from the other tech alliance, I have told them to keep stalling this alliance's overtures, at least until Egypt lands the Oracle on T62.

Horseback Riding tech has been started, current ETA T73, but will probably be finished a couple of turns sooner.

If someone could forward this information to our "outer member" (i.e. Portugal), we'd be much obliged.


Highest Regards,


Ilios - DIM

HRE,

Thanks for the email, but I'm afraid that I may have to suggest something that you find to be a complete anathema. I think we need to ask France into the Alliance.

I'll give you reasons why here: We have 2 Fin and 1 Phi civ without France. The counter alliance has 5 Fin and 2 Phi civs, if they have France. 3/2 v 4/1 sounds slightly more in our favour. It also means that HRE, England, Eygpt and Portugal only have to deal with a single front, instead of dealing with a possible enemy stack coming up from around France. Without France me and England might find it difficult to mount a strong attack on France, because we have other borders to protect, due to hte lay out of our front (we are both on the corners in the south).

Now, I know France have been rude and aggressive, and I agree with you that they need to be exterminated, but we have bigger fish to fry right now. You have aggressive Rome to your NE, aligned against you. Me Carthage and England have the entire row south of us aligned against us, with the row behind them stuck in a 3v3 war, so have no worries on that flank. They might be backward now, but remember the lesson of the NUTA, it doesn't take long to catch up.

FWIW, I agree with you that France need to die, and I'm willing to agree to a long term (hidden) agreement to remove France from the game, but right now they are a tool that we need to use.

I know Ilios is a great used car salesman, so if you agree with this, please can you try and grab France into the Alliance as fast as you can?

Thanks in advance,

Krill

[Krill]

Scout pic dump, t57:

[Krill]

Reply to Cathage. Regarding the border treaty, I don't mind if I have to move a city and lose the horses, but I won't move it and lose the sheep. That is the only food res that I can see east of my capital. Can meet England in between 3 and 5 turns.

Salutations to the Carthaginian!

It is with great pleasure that I accept your offer of a 25 turn NAP, and the confirmation that you are part of the Alliance is most heart warming.

I would like to thank you for the directions to meet England, however there is one factor that you may have overlooked. I finish research into Writing at the end of this turn, and could hence offer Open Borders. If you were willing to grant me this boon, then it would mean that John Keel could move NE-E-NE and meet England several turns earlier, and heal in the safety of your borders. As there is a barb warrior on your travels to the NW, I am sure I could offer the same benefit to you in kind should the barbarian warrior attempt to waylay your scout.

I would also like to offer you a Hindu missionary, on the house, and some sort of border. I think the peaks would make a good starting point.

Tanks in advance,

Krill

[spacemanmf]

"Tanks in advance,"

Threat of an ultimate Modern Age assault?

[Krill]

Knowing this crowd I'll probably get gang banged before the industrial era...

(damned typo, spilling my plans!)