[PB66] Lurking the Chaos

[Mjmd]

Just wanted to create to get moved to Important Threads.

[Commodore]

1. Piccadilly + plemo - Tokugawa of Rome
2. Amicalola - Washington (CHA/EXP) of Khmer
3. Gavagai - Suryavarman (CRE/EXP) of Aztec
4. Tarkeel + civac - Mehmed (EXP/ORG) of Spain
5. Mjmd - Julius Caesar (IMP/ORG) of Zulu
6. Superdeath - Hammurabi (AGG/ORG) of Vikings
7. GeneralKillCavalry - Kublai Khan (AGG/CRE) of America
8. Alhazard - Napoleon (CHA/ORG) of Egypt
9. Miguelito + Ginger - Asoka (ORG/SPI) of The Holy Roman Empire
10. Vanrober - Zara Yaqob (ORG/CRE) of Mongolia
11. Magic Science - Sulieman (IMP/PHI) of Greece
12. JackRB - Lieu-Ye (Org/Pro) of Carthage

Huh, no aggro picks outside of P&P, possibly GKC.

[naufragar]

Piccadilly and Plemo have been posting a bunch over at Civforum, where they've been bouncing a bunch of ideas around, pretty consistently valuing Org and Pro. Idk. Something about Toku of Rome feels weird. I get the thinking (they wanted Pro, already had Rome, so why not add Agg too); it just doesn't sit well with me.

GKC's Agg/Cre America makes me smile. One day someone's going to just go ham with Guerilla/Woody muskets and make all the lurkers happy.

I could see Superdeath's Agg/Org Vikings being amazing on this map. This too would make me smile.

But otherwise, yeah, a bunch of peaceniks.

[Krill]

There is definitely a problem with perception of trait balance (not a comment on the actual balance, just players beliefs about it).

I'm glad Mig and Ginger didn't pick Egypt though. They are well placed to win via a Corp fueled domination at the end.

The map will get cramped well before knights though so I expect there will be brawling and WE are going to make that quite difficult...

[RefSteel]

I'm a bit late here, but in case you're not reading the German thread, I just wanted to mention:

I like our starting position. You have many options to play the start. Currently I'm leaning towards a double AB start and settlers before BT. You could even start with sails and build a fast LT if you take Hammurabi. Alternatively, you could start with bronze. In any case, you can play many quite different variants.

Yes, I also find the starting position exciting.

[naufragar]

I like our starting position. You have many options to play the start. Currently I'm leaning towards a double AB start and settlers before BT. You could even start with sails and build a fast LT if you take Hammurabi. Alternatively, you could start with bronze. In any case, you can play many quite different variants.

With AB meaning "workboat" (Arbeitsboot). BT=worker (Bautrupp)

[Krill]

I'm liking the triple work boat and settler before worker from Postage and Packaging.

[Charriu]

T50
Once again we are at the T50 mark. So let's dive into the report. As always all the data can be found here: PB66 Tracking

Before we start some notable observations:

• This game has been rather peaceful so far.
  
• Only Stonehenge has been built so far by Superdeath (T48). I see somebody found a new favorite toy.
  

Since this PB is running CtH 3.0, we got some new data points. By now I've explained all data points here: data points explanation

General state of the game
City count

1. Mjmd (IMP) = 5
   
2. Gavagai = 4
   
3. Magic Science (IMP) = 3
   
4. Piccadilly & Plemo = 3
   
5. GKC = 3
   
6. Amicalola = 3
   
7. JackRB = 3
   
8. Miguelito = 3
   
9. Tarkeel = 3
   
10. Superdeath = 3
    
11. Vanrober = 3
    
12. Alhazard = 3
    

Population

1. Miguelito = 11
   
2. Gavagai = 10
   
3. Mjmd (IMP) = 9
   
4. Alhazard = 9
   
5. Magic Science (IMP) = 9
   
6. Piccadilly & Plemo = 9
   
7. GKC = 8
   
8. Amicalola = 8
   
9. JackRB = 8
   
10. Vanrober = 8
    
11. Tarkeel = 6
    
12. Superdeath = 5
    

Mjmd made good use of his IMP trait so far and expanded fast.

Current turn Gold at 100%

1. Magic Science = 31
   
2. Piccadilly & Plemo (AGG, PRO) = 31
   
3. Gavagai = 27
   
4. Miguelito (ORG) = 25
   
5. Mjmd (ORG) = 24
   
6. Alhazard (ORG) = 24
   
7. Amicalola = 24
   
8. JackRB (ORG, PRO) = 24
   
9. GKC (AGG) = 23
   
10. Vanrober ORG) = 22
    
11. Tarkeel (ORG) = 19
    
12. Superdeath (ORG, AGG) = 19
    

Overall everybody is fairly close together. Still this early in the game these numbers can change a lot as slavery has a much bigger impact on them.

Current turn total maintenance

1. Miguelito (ORG) = 4
   
2. Alhazard (ORG) = 4
   
3. JackRB (ORG, PRO) = 4
   
4. Vanrober ORG) = 4
   
5. Superdeath (ORG, AGG) = 4
   
6. Tarkeel (ORG) = 6
   
7. Amicalola = 7
   
8. Piccadilly & Plemo (AGG, PRO) = 8
   
9. GKC (AGG) = 8
   
10. Magic Science = 9
    
11. Gavagai = 13
    
12. Mjmd (ORG) = 16
    

To nobody's wonder the ORG gang is on top of this. Of course Gavagai and Mjmd are at the bottom with them having the most cities.

Current turn maintenance-gold delta

1. Piccadilly & Plemo (AGG, PRO) = 23
   
2. Magic Science = 22
   
3. Miguelito (ORG) = 21
   
4. Alhazard (ORG) = 20
   
5. JackRB (ORG, PRO) = 20
   
6. Vanrober ORG) = 18
   
7. Amicalola = 17
   
8. GKC (AGG) = 15
   
9. Superdeath (ORG, AGG) = 15
   
10. Gavagai = 14
    
11. Tarkeel (ORG) = 13
    
12. Mjmd (ORG) = 8
    

Accumulated actual science

1. Piccadilly & Plemo (AGG, PRO) = 672
   
2. JackRB (ORG, PRO) = 658
   
3. Miguelito (ORG) = 642
   
4. Superdeath (ORG, AGG) = 613
   
5. Tarkeel (ORG) = 613
   
6. Alhazard (ORG) = 610
   
7. Amicalola = 576
   
8. Gavagai = 572
   
9. GKC (AGG) = 564
   
10. Vanrober ORG) = 563
    
11. Mjmd (ORG) = 563
    
12. Magic Science = 558
    

The PRO players and Miguelito are carving out a small tech advantage so far.
But what exactly did the players do with all those beakers. Well fear not here it is:




It should be fairly self explantory. It's all the techs the players have researched so far. The number in front is the turn the players acquired the tech. Overall nothing to surprising that we didn't know of already. I was a bit disappointed that not everybody had exactly the same amount of techs.

Food

Accumulated food towards growth + foodkept = total food

1. Amicalola (EXP) = 191 + 50 = 241
   
2. Magic Science (IMP) = 239
   
3. Alhazard = 198 + 27 = 225
   
4. Piccadilly & Plemo = 222
   
5. Miguelito = 205
   
6. Vanrober = 182
   
7. JackRB = 181
   
8. Superdeath = 178
   
9. Gavagai (EXP) = 157
   
10. Mjmd (IMP) = 157
    
11. Tarkeel (EXP) = 133 + 21 = 154
    
12. GKC = 123
    

Some big margins in growth here and interestingly bigger numbers here do not necessarily mean more whips as we will see shortly. Amicalola is already making good use of his EXP trait.

Production
Accumulated total production
You will find the unmodified production in parenthesis if it differs. I only show relevant traits here.

1. Amicalola (EXP) = 657 (600)
   
2. Magic Science (IMP) = 583 (518)
   
3. Mjmd (IMP) = 581 (471)
   
4. Tarkeel (EXP) = 566 (529)
   
5. Piccadilly & Plemo = 516
   
6. Superdeath = 456
   
7. Alhazard = 423
   
8. GKC = 415
   
9. Vanrober = 413
   
10. JackRB (ORG) = 398 (388)
    
11. Miguelito = 341
    
12. Gavagai (EXP) = 325
    

Huge differences. I think we could have expected the EXP and IMP players to be on top of this. But even with unmodified hammers we see huge differences.

Total whip production

1. Amicalola (EXP) = 120
   
2. Tarkeel (EXP) = 120
   
3. Superdeath = 105
   
4. Magic Science (IMP) = 90
   
5. Mjmd (IMP) = 90
   
6. Vanrober = 90
   
7. Piccadilly & Plemo = 60
   
8. Alhazard = 60
   
9. JackRB (ORG) = 60
   
10. GKC = 0
    
11. Miguelito = 0
    
12. Gavagai (EXP) = 0
    

Total chop production

1. Tarkeel (EXP) = 120
   
2. Magic Science (IMP) = 100
   
3. Amicalola (EXP) = 60
   
4. Superdeath = 60
   
5. Piccadilly & Plemo = 60
   
6. Alhazard = 40
   
7. JackRB (ORG) = 20
   
8. GKC = 20
   
9. Gavagai (EXP) = 20
   
10. Mjmd (IMP) = 0
    
11. Vanrober = 0
    
12. Miguelito = 0
    

With the above data in mind we can say for sure that the traits produced the following amounts of extra hammers:
IMP (Mjmd) = 110
IMP (Magic Science) = 65
EXP (Amicalola) = 57
EXP (Tarkeel) = 37
ORG (JackRB) = 10

Financial Bonus

This will be rather short since nobody is benefiting from FIN so far. Only Gavagai would have made 30 extra commerce from FIN.

Protective Bonus

Everybody is fairly equal in the current numbers so let's look into the accumulated numbers

1. Miguelito (ORG) = 57
   
2. Piccadilly & Plemo (AGG, PRO) = 51
   
3. Alhazard (ORG) = 51
   
4. Gavagai = 47
   
5. Mjmd (ORG) = 46
   
6. Superdeath (ORG, AGG) = 42
   
7. Vanrober ORG) = 41
   
8. JackRB (ORG, PRO) = 40
   
9. Tarkeel (ORG) = 40
   
10. Amicalola = 33
    
11. Magic Science = 23
    
12. GKC (AGG) = 22
    

Magic Science and GKC are late to connect their cities. Meanwhile Piccadilly & Plemo are making good use of PRO.

Misc

I'm tracking a lot more but there is not enough information there to justify an own paragraph. Therefore a little summary here:

• No great persons so far to no ones surprise.
  

I'm also tracking the labor civics and therefore can determine, when everybody switched to slavery. These are the times they did.

1. Magic Science = T23
   
2. Piccadilly & Plemo (AGG, PRO) = T27
   
3. Amicalola = T31
   
4. Tarkeel (ORG) = T31
   
5. Superdeath (ORG, AGG) = T31
   
6. JackRB (ORG, PRO) = T32
   
7. Vanrober ORG) = T35
   
8. Mjmd (ORG) = T37
   
9. Alhazard (ORG) = T37
   
10. GKC (AGG) = T46
    
11. Gavagai = T48
    
12. Miguelito (ORG) = T49
    

Comparing traits

The main goal of all this tracking of course is to compare the economic traits related around commerce income or maintenance reduction.




As you can see PRO is fairly safe in 1st position followed by emperor ORG.

Stay tuned for the T100 report.

[Cornflakes]

For those not following the Civforum reports, the Plemo/Piccadilly team and Superdeath are in a coinflip over Great Lighthouse this turn P/P could have whipped to completion last turn at some overall inefficiency of 45 hammers or so (by following different micro for the last couple turns).

[El Grillo]

I think Magic Science's preference for ceasefires over peace treaties is going to hurt him here against the Romans. I was a bit concerned when he said he felt safe because there were no Roman units visible, when they could road up and move right next to Demeter with no warning.