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[SPOILERS] Lurkers Thread - Well someone has to do it

Maksim Wrote:animal-based food resources instead of grains... no river

Not quite, they have a FP, Oasis, and sheep, where the others got either 2 FP, 1 FP and unirrigated wheat, or irrigated wheat. (Or in the Lanun case, only 1 FP, though the ability to move inland and have 2-3.) The capitals are all pretty different, the main thing I equalized was food surplus at small sizes (and secondarily, I gave everyone about 1 commerce resource).

Balseraphs had 5 river tiles (as well as some lakeside spaces for farms) until they moved south and lost 4 of them.

In general the capital sites are not impressive compared to a normal map script capital. Everyone has secondary city sites available that are better than their capital. I do agree the Balseraph capital is on the worse end. But I don't think it should have been a big deal yet. He screwed up his early game a bit by moving south, I think.

Right now I'm a bit more concerned about the civ density: it looks like the 4 in the north are inclined towards feistiness with one another while those in the south get left alone. Well, we'll see how it plays out. FFH1 was far less equalized and still made for a good game.
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It seems everyone wondering how Serdoa has Loki and three cities have forgotten that he's swapped to Expansive.

Also, I think he's only got four warriors, one for each city and an exploring one. Plus Loki.
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Does anybody want to do "a brief history of time" for the benefit of new lurkers (me)?
I have to run.
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novice Wrote:Does anybody want to do "a brief history of time" for the benefit of new lurkers (me)?

I'll give that an attempt, but frankly, you've come at a good time. The bulk of the game so far has been growth and city founding, but things are just now starting to heat up. For an excellent summary of the current state of the game, look at Maksim's post on the previous page.

To start with, SevenSpirits built the map, and the general consensus is that the lands are poor, but balanced. Instead of the common approach of giving everyone an extremely lush start, we had the mirror image - no one was happy with their start, but they were pretty much all equally unhappy lol. Nearly everyone founded in place despite that, with the notable exception of Uberfish's elves, who moved for at least two turns before settling down.

The map is also relatively cramped; the 2nd and 3rd cities people are founding are already causing friction and accusations of settling aggressively. The general layout is, I believe,
Mist(Doviello) - Sciz (Luchiurp) - Ilios (Malakim) - Serdoa (Balseraphs)
Uberfish (Ljosalfar) - Amelia (Lanun) - Sunrise/Darrell (Calabim)

Brief histories of each civ follow (there hasn't been enough interaction for a more unified approach as yet):
Uberfish and the Ljosalfar. Uberfish moved initially (north, toward his neighbors), and eventually found a spot he was ok with. As he believed he was behind, he explored the Pyre of the Seraphic, and landed a free Great Sage as nearly the first thing he did. Since then, he's been teching toward Way of the Forests while aiming for diplomatic peace with his neighbors; he's since gotten an NAP with the Vampires and has collaborated with Mist's Doviello to plan a rush of his last neighbor, Sciz's Luchiurp. At this point, he appears to be going for long term peace and non-conflict, while getting the elven economy rolling. Any longer term plans are being kept quiet.

Mist and the Doviello. Mist has been planning to rush from turn 1. His somewhat unconventional approach is to leverage the Doviello traits hard - he's going for gold production and building his army out of workers, who will upgrade to axes on the enemy border. He's gone for Markets and then Bronze working, with an unconventional economy with heavy emphasis on getting gold to use with Ingenuity for his upgrades. His goal is to let no one have peace and prosperity, especially not the Big 3 - Malakim, Vampires, and Lanun. Last we heard about tech, he had landed a Great Prophet which he intended to use for Kilmorph; he had believed/does believe that copper is very scarce, so thinks Iron from the Mines could let him dominate. He's very close to being able to launch the first war. Originally, his target was Sciz's Luchiurp, as the greater threat than Uberfish's elves among his next door neighbors, but recently he's talked about skipping Sciz and going for Ilios instead. We'll have to wait and see what target he settles on.

Sciz and the Luchiurp. Sciz has founded a decent city, and has been focusing on expansion and growth. Recently, he's become extremely annoyed by Ilios' expansion toward him, and as he just got Construction for his first golems, is planning to hit Ilios in the next 50 turns or so, aiming for destruction. He'll be popping his worldspell in the next 50 turns, most likely; currently undecided what the optimal moment is, but it won't wait too long. He hasn't had a lot of diplomacy with anyone, so I think Mist will surprise him with the army at the border. Depending on his negotiations, we'll see what happens next.

Ilios and the Malakim. Ilios has focused completely on expansion. Without much barb activity, he's been pretty successful at it as well, enough to annoy Sciz and make Mist nervous. He hasn't talked much about his long term plans, just short term activities.

Serdoa and the Balseraphs. Serdoa's been mostly quiet in terms of plans, but the dominant feature is that he's roleplaying the insane clowns. Most/all of his diplomacy is in poetry, or contains hidden messages, or a streak of insanity, or all of the above. His first Insane trait switch was extremely lucky - turn 23 he got Philosophical/Financial/Expansive. He's pushing his neighbors; recently brought Loki to the vamps borders, and is currently at war as a result, which is what he expected. If they hadn't declared, he'd have attempted to steal their second city.

sunrise/darrell and the Calabim. They've been aiming for mostly expansion, although they've recently considered the idea of a bronze warrior rush to penalize people for running light on military. They're running behind on tech and expansion and know it; haven't placed the blame yet, though. They're beelining Vampires directly, hardly any diversions, and seem to be intending that to be their breakout moment. They haven't used Rivers of Blood yet, which is confusing most of their opponents.

Amelia and the Lanun. Amelia's started pretty isolated, has only found a couple neighbors and hardly anyone's found her. She's going directly for Pirate Cove cities, has founded Octopus Overlords, and eventually plans to get Chalid and conquer all. She's in a pretty good position, largely because her neighbors are leaving her alone to expand. On the other hand, she was one of the last to their 2nd city.
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Brilliant, thank you Mardoc and Maksim. Happy to see the game's heating up. smile

Mardoc Wrote:His first Insane trait switch was extremely lucky - turn 23 he got Philosophical/Financial/Expansive.

yikes
I have to run.
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Yeah, it happened when I was playing and I told him to get those settlers out straight away, after hitting size 5.

It worked out well.
Current games (All): RtR: PB83

Ended games (Selection): BTS games: PB1, PB3, PBEM2, PBEM4, PBEM5B, PBEM50. RB mod games: PB5, PB15, PB27, PB37, PB42, PB46, PB71 PB80. FFH games: PBEMVII, PBEMXII. Civ 6:  PBEM22 PBEM23Games ded lurked: PB18
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Where is Orthus? Apparently he spawned "somewhere near the Lanun" according to the one civ who could see the spawn indicator. But their knowledge of where the Lanun are is approximate, and Amelia has not mentioned anything so far.

Could someone be in for a nasty surprise? The longer it takes for Orthus to reach someone the more promoted he will be; even a handful of turns is enough for the first couple Combat promos.
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Ilios noted that the Calabim have lost points, and guessed that it was a pop loss - which doesn't seem correct since they don't have any 1 pop cities. I'm not sure what else goes into score besides tech/population/land, if anything, but if Orthus spawned near the Lanun or somewhat near the Lanun, he could very well have gone to visit the Calabim instead. Their thread hasn't been updated.
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I just love all the talk from Mist (and some others, but he's the rusher) about who they see as a threat.

And who does he attack? The vampires he fears so? Any of the 4 civs he listed as bigger threats? Nah... Let's mess with the builder civ that's already boxed in.

Also uberfish is playing some underhanded diplo, quietly selling the Luchuirp out. He picked the wrong elves smile
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HelloGoodSir Wrote:I just love all the talk from Mist (and some others, but he's the rusher) about who they see as a threat.

And who does he attack? The vampires he fears so? Any of the 4 civs he listed as bigger threats? Nah... Let's mess with the builder civ that's already boxed in.

Mist could attack the vamps, but what does he get out of it? Sure, one less late game threat, but everyone else gets that too and Mist is the one who has to pay for it.

At least when attacking the dwarfs he gets some land out of it, whereas I doubt he could get much out of the former vamp land. I don't really follow his reasoning about attacking the Malakim (except that they don't have anything close to Wood Golems/Barnaxus) but I guess after Ilios gets Runes Mist will try and go for Ilios anyway.
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